Triple_Putt Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 I don’t really have an opinion, but I do feel bad for the guys that stood by the PGA and their hard stance, and have seemingly had the rug pulled out from underneath them. I’m sure more info will come out and we will see the story evolve. satcomm302, MattWillGolf and chisag 3 Quote Super Burner 2.0 10.5* Fly-Z hybrid SMS 4-GW i3 5 Wood SM7 56*,60*, SM8 52* Versa 1 putter 2023 Tested: Edel SMS Irons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Middler Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 7 hours ago, funkyjudge said: What the F are you smoking? Lighten up Francis. We disagree, that’s allowed… Quote Titleist TSR2 11° HZRDUS Red CB 50 6.0 w Lamkin UTx Midsize Titleist TSR2 16.5º HZRDUS Red 60 CB 6.0 & TSR2 21º HZRDUS Black 4G 70 6.0 w Lamkin UTx Midsize Mizuno JPX923 HMP 4-GW, T22 54.12WS, T22 58.04DC w Lamkin ST+2 Hybrid Midsize LAB DF3 w Accra Maxfli Tour & ProV1 Ping Pioneer - MGI Zip Navigator AT Payntr X 002 LE, Ecco Biom C4, Payntr X 001 F (Mesh) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Middler Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 You didn’t notice the already active thread? Why start another? https://forum.mygolfspy.com/topic/59608-pga-tour-liv-merger/ tony@CIC 1 Quote Titleist TSR2 11° HZRDUS Red CB 50 6.0 w Lamkin UTx Midsize Titleist TSR2 16.5º HZRDUS Red 60 CB 6.0 & TSR2 21º HZRDUS Black 4G 70 6.0 w Lamkin UTx Midsize Mizuno JPX923 HMP 4-GW, T22 54.12WS, T22 58.04DC w Lamkin ST+2 Hybrid Midsize LAB DF3 w Accra Maxfli Tour & ProV1 Ping Pioneer - MGI Zip Navigator AT Payntr X 002 LE, Ecco Biom C4, Payntr X 001 F (Mesh) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke James Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 The PGA Tour and LIV Golf have come together in a signed agreement to consolidate their commercial businesses and rights under a yet-to-be-named new company as per sources. The agreement encompasses the inclusion of the PGA European Tour, also referred to as the DP World Tour. Here is one of the articles that I found interesting and have tried to covered in depth content related to this topic - https://golfercraze.com/liv-golf-vs-pga/ What are your thoughts regarding this "On going war of golf?" Is it a boon or bane? RollingGreens 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke James Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 7 minutes ago, Middler said: You didn’t notice the already active thread? Why start another? https://forum.mygolfspy.com/topic/59608-pga-tour-liv-merger/ I didn't notice that. My bad. tony@CIC 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guido723723 Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 It's all about MONEY. I've watched my last golf tournament. RIP 911 victims tony@CIC and Kansas King 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franc38 Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 It's both good (we'll stop having the constant bickering about the "my tour is morally better than yours": really, none are any good, morally, they are sports organizations! and the "cancel culture of golf" is disgusting) and bad (all the major tours will be under one unique umbrella organization, so competition will just vanish and the push for new concepts, ideas and so on that really work will likely disappear). It's not about money, it's about control. The money is just a compensation for the tools that are used in the powers war being waged there. RollingGreens 1 Quote Aim small... pray to miss small My bag: Ping hoofer lite. My driver: Nike Vapor Pro. 4w: Inesis 500. Hybrid: Nike Vapor Flex. Irons (4-PW): Takomo 301 combo on KBS tour X. Wedges: Vokey SM7 52° and 58°. Putter: Cleveland Classic HB1. Balls: Inesis Tour900 yellow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RollingGreens Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 Wesley Bryan did a good job of describing how the meeting went on the Monday Q info. Can’t wait to see how this plays out. I don’t think it’ll be a merger, I think they eliminated competition and lawyer fees without getting exposed in discovery. I assume the LIV guys will pay a fine to return, however I hope the guys who stayed are compensated. They carried the water enough the last 2 years for a tour they run just to have Jay making deals behind their back. Also jay needs to bring enough Monday to the table not just for the top tier guys but for all tiers to make sure his job is secure. As much as it seems like he drank the koolaid watching succession, I’d be overly concerned that he guaranteed this to the Saudi’s Charles Lechair and MattF 2 Quote Stealth 2 Plus 9deg Kai' li Red Stealth 2 13deg Aldilla Rogue Silver Stealth 2 15deg Aldilla Rogue Silver JPX 921 Hot Metal 4-PW Nippon Modus 120s SM8 54 and 58deg Dynamic Gold Wedge Flex Scotty Cameron Newport 2 Titleist ProV1 Hoofer Stand Bag Stewart Q Follow Electric Caddie 300 PRO Rangefinder Official Nippon Regio B+ Driver Shaft Review Official Stewart Q Follow Review Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schenectady Putter Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 This hits me in two distinct and separate ways. As someone who objects to the corrupting influence of money and the "sports washing" of a corrupt regime I find this crass money grab abhorrent. As a lifetime golfer who always enjoyed the game's higher ideals of fair play I lament it's inevitable reputational decline by being associated with this hypocrisy. "Morality, like the families of September 11 victims and Jamal Khashoggi, was merely a convenient posture to adopt until the time arrived when space was cleared at the trough." hoppman, chisag, satcomm302 and 2 others 5 Quote Titleist TSi2 Driver Titleist TSi2 3 Wood Titleist TS Hybrid Wilson Staff C300 4-PW Titleist Vokeys 48-54-8 Ping Putter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy E Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 On July 18, 2022, as high-profile golfers like Phil Mickelson were defecting to LIV for paydays worth hundreds of millions, Trump took to his social media platform to warn the players remaining with the PGA Tour. "All of those golfers that remain 'loyal' to the very disloyal PGA, in all of its different forms, will pay a big price when the inevitable MERGER with LIV comes, and you get nothing but a big 'thank you' from PGA officials who are making Millions of Dollars a year," Trump wroteon Truth Social. "If you don't take the money now, you will get nothing after the merger takes place, and only say how smart the original signees were." Nearly 11 months later, the merger was announced, catching many PGA players — who were not consulted ahead of time as a group — off guard. "No f****** way," one PGA player told ESPN when informed of the deal. Bogey free and Franc38 1 1 Quote Driver: Callaway Rogue ST Max 10.5, set to 10.5°, R Flex Fairway: Callaway Rogue ST Max 5W, 18°, R Flex Hybrid: Callaway Apex 21 Pro, 3H, 20°, R Flex; Apex 21, 5H, set to 24°, R Flex Irons 6-9, PW, GW: 0311P, Gen3, Graphite, R Flex Wedges: Titleist Vokey SM8, 54° & 58° Chipper: Ping ChipR, Black dot Putter: Ping Heppler Fetch, set to 34" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geno 220 Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 Pitiful, just plain greed, very disappointing Kansas King 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeremyD Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 I was shocked to hear it, but some people called it months ago. It’s too early to see a winner in this. LIV players seem pumped, however, some are saying LIV is essentially dead. I doubt it’s totally dead. Rory and Norman were throwing shade at each other and both were out of the loop. I’m more surprised that Norman was left out and makes me think he’s gonna be unemployed. so this the second time Norman wanted to be a lead in a breakaway type league that eventually falls under the PGA Tour (or his idea for the high paying special events). I’m awaiting Rory, Tiger, Greg, and even Jack to make statements. and this new for profit league. All of these guys wanted to play less (so they said). so much to process. Thankfully I’m on the road the next 7 days. Maybe we’ll know more Quote When my wife asked if I wanted to leave Maine and move to where she grew up, I couldn't say no to Pinehurst, NC. I honestly don't spend much money on golf equipment, but I'm constantly reading reviews in case I ever get ready to buy I swing left handed and have been the State of Maine Left Hander's champion since 1997, the last year they held the tournament. I'm currently a 7.1 handicap. Trying to get lower, but my gut gets in the way. WITB Driver: Epic speed 9 degree Irons: 990's S300 Stiff shafts bought when I was in college. (Received a personal use discount, otherwise would've stuck with my Hogan Edge's) 3 Wood: Epic speed 15 degree or PT15 52/56/60 Z Spin wedges (heck of a deal $100 for all 3 at Dick's in 2013) Putter: OG Rossie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James S Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 Funny how short minded and blind everyone is. This is not a “merger” it is a take over. How is this going to inspire millions and “grow” the game, it’s the exact same players just coming back. PIF admitted the LIV product was junk and it will probably go away with maybe a few more team events but not a LIV tour anymore. So what we have now is the tour from three years ago, stepping backwards, and giving the Saudi government part ownership of the PGA with media access. Jay Monahan probably got a fat check and is going from PGA Commissioner to CEO? Who voted or agreed to let him become CEO? A lot of the PGA players have asked for his resignation since he made this shady deal. Rickp, hoppman, Kansas King and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rickp Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 21 hours ago, GolfSpy MPR said: I'm going to need about two weeks to figure out what my take is on this. My thoughts also…. Quote Rick Left Hand, Driver; PXG 0311XF Cypher 50 gr Senior 5 wood; Ping 425, Senior Shaft 55 gr 7 wood; Ping 425, Senior Shaft 55 gr 5 hybrid; Cally Steelhead, Hazardous R2 Irons; Mizuno JPX 923HM 7-GW Recoil 460 F2 Wedges; Titleist S9 54*, Mizuno SW 56* Putter; Waaay too many to list Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Preeway Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 I’m with @GolfSpy_APH on this one and will wait to say much in the way of opinion one way or the other until more firm details are known. The devil is always in the details as they say. I really want to see if the LIV format lives or dies with regards to team competition and whether the LIV captains will retain any access to profitability from their team names starting in 2024. That’s really the only unique component to LIV that exists. I don’t see shotgun starts becoming a thing or three day events. I’m also really interested to see how the influx of money changes the designated events next year. Will there be more or will the purses be even higher? And will the non designated events have bigger purses as well? Last, I’m interested to see if the players begin to push back against the number of required events they have to appear in. It’s clear the rest players get with LIV is benefiting both physical and mental health of the players. Hopefully we can all get along while we wait for more specifics to come out over the days and weeks ahead. Rickp 1 Quote Driver: Aerojet LS, Ventus Blue Shaft - 6S 4 Wood: Rogue ST Max 16.5, Tensei White Shaft - 7S Utility Iron: Fli Hi 3-iron, HAZARDOUS Smoke Black Shaft - S Irons: JPX 921 Tour 4-P, Project X Shafts - Stiff 125g Wedges: 52º, 56º, 60º Putter: Ai-One 7 T CH, 34" Preferred Ball: Z-Star Diamond Pushcart: Nitron Rangefinder: Tour V5 Shift Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thumper1978 Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 PGA tour was going to be exposed on something in court. Or something like that I believe that is what really was the change of heart. Plus now the PGA will be flush with cash they can now do whatever they want now. But this kinda stinks I hate the unknown. Hopefully they make great decisions, and now there are more events all over the world, and in places in the United States, that everybody can go see them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WiTerp50 Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 I’ve known that the nonprofit status was a thin veneer to look respectable. Now that is completely blown up. The LIV players are the big winners, the biggest payouts will be geared to the top 70, and the charitable contributions will not come close to getting a share of the pie. Today I’m wondering if I will ever again buy a mandatory uniform package and spend my time and money (food, lodging, transportation, etc.) to work a PGA Tour event to support players creating generational wealth. Quote Titleist TSR 11 degree, HZRDS Red R 44.75 LH Titleist TSR-1 5/7 Woods LH Titleist TSR-1 23 Hybrid LH Titleist T200 7-48 - T350 6 Tensai AMT Red LH Titleist SM9 50-54-58 TT AMT Red LH Scotty Phantom X 7.5 RH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattWillGolf Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 “The answer to all of your questions is money.” I’d highly recommend listening to the podcast from the Fire Pit Collective on the this topic. Alan Shipnuck, author of the Phil book, a good read BTW, was finishing up a book on the PGA/LIV saga when this hit. The “Readers Digest” version of the podcast is this caught most folks on both sides completely off guard. But in general terms the Saudis appear to have decided that there was no pay off in sight and they want to long term improve their image to the world and to make Saudi a golf destination like Dubai but bigger and better in order to bring in tourists and leverage golf for the business connections that golf uniquely offers and LIV wasn’t doing that for them. The PGA Tour has tapped out their sponsors and they won’t be able to sustain the purses that the elevated events demand. Money created a marriage of convenience the Saudis have money to spend but don’t have the “image” needed and the PGA has the image but not the money. For me though, men’s professional golf got a lot less interesting. Rickp 1 Quote Anyday Maverick Black Ops 7-way 0311 Black Ops 8° w/Mitsubishi Diamana S+ 60 0311 XF 3 wood 16° w/Mitsubishi Tensei AV Raw Blue Paradym X 5 - GW w/True Temper Elevate MPH Official Forum Test SM9 54°/12° D and 58°/12° D w/KBS Tour 110 DF3 w/BGT Stability ONE Forum Test ER11v 34” Evnroll ER11v Official Forum Test Shot Scope Pro LX+ Pro LX+ Official Forum Test Elixr 3.5+ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LICC Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 2 hours ago, Guido723723 said: It's all about MONEY. I've watched my last golf tournament. RIP 911 victims You can still watch the majors ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LICC Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 2 hours ago, Franc38 said: It's both good (we'll stop having the constant bickering about the "my tour is morally better than yours": really, none are any good, morally, they are sports organizations! and the "cancel culture of golf" is disgusting) and bad (all the major tours will be under one unique umbrella organization, so competition will just vanish and the push for new concepts, ideas and so on that really work will likely disappear). It's not about money, it's about control. The money is just a compensation for the tools that are used in the powers war being waged there. Immorality equivocation. Ugh ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony@CIC Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 2 hours ago, Guido723723 said: It's all about MONEY. I've watched my last golf tournament. RIP 911 victims I agree - won't be watching any PGA/LIV events. However, I'll still be watching LPGA - I preferred watching them anyway over the guys. Kansas King, hoppman, russtopherb and 1 other 4 Quote Left Hand orientation SIM 2 D Max with Fujikura Air Speeder Shaft Cobra Radspeed 3W/RIptide Shaft 410 Hybrids 22*, 26* Cobra Speed Zone 6-GP/Recoil ESX 460 F3 Shafts SM7 54* Wedge Glide 3.0 60* Wedge O Works putter V3 NX9-HD - 4 Wheel EZGO TXT 48v cart - too many shoes to list and so many to buy And BAG Boy Golf Balls: Vice Pro Plus 2020 Official Tester Beginning Driver Speed - 78 2019 Official Tester 410 Driver 2018 Official Tester C300 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LICC Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 25 minutes ago, Preeway said: I’m with @GolfSpy_APH on this one and will wait to say much in the way of opinion one way or the other until more firm details are known. The devil is always in the details as they say. I really want to see if the LIV format lives or dies with regards to team competition and whether the LIV captains will retain any access to profitability from their team names starting in 2024. That’s really the only unique component to LIV that exists. I don’t see shotgun starts becoming a thing or three day events. I’m also really interested to see how the influx of money changes the designated events next year. Will there be more or will the purses be even higher? And will the non designated events have bigger purses as well? Last, I’m interested to see if the players begin to push back against the number of required events they have to appear in. It’s clear the rest players get with LIV is benefiting both physical and mental health of the players. Hopefully we can all get along while we wait for more specifics to come out over the days and weeks ahead. I can only guess that Monahan and Dunne were getting pressure from sponsors who were unwilling to up their payments anymore, and losing sponsor money from non-designated events. They saw this along with the increases in purses as unsustainable long-term, and PIF basically said they don't care if they lose $5 billion they were going to keep attacking the Tour and poaching players. As well as pushing costly litigation. Monahan and Dunne may have seen this merger as survival and the only best option. Point to the players who took the LIV money as providing the leverage to put the Tour in this position. Rickp 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puttingmatt Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 Its a smart move, and it will be interesting what the changes will look like when the storm settles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmk! Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 No love for LIV here. LIV and let die is what I say. tony@CIC 1 Quote Anxiety is contagious, please keep yours to yourself ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Preeway Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 15 minutes ago, LICC said: I can only guess that Monahan and Dunne were getting pressure from sponsors who were unwilling to up their payments anymore, and losing sponsor money from non-designated events. They saw this along with the increases in purses as unsustainable long-term, and PIF basically said they don't care if they lose $5 billion they were going to keep attacking the Tour and poaching players. As well as pushing costly litigation. Monahan and Dunne may have seen this merger as survival and the only best option. Point to the players who took the LIV money as providing the leverage to put the Tour in this position. I too speculate that the well may have been running dry on USA sponsors with the new direction the PGAT wanted to go with designated events. Honda is done as a sponsor after 30+ years. Wouldn’t be surprised if others were going to follow suit. Taking the PIF money may have been the only financial way forward to fight off LIV. Who knows. It’s a bad look for now and loyal Tour players have every right to be pissed. tony@CIC 1 Quote Driver: Aerojet LS, Ventus Blue Shaft - 6S 4 Wood: Rogue ST Max 16.5, Tensei White Shaft - 7S Utility Iron: Fli Hi 3-iron, HAZARDOUS Smoke Black Shaft - S Irons: JPX 921 Tour 4-P, Project X Shafts - Stiff 125g Wedges: 52º, 56º, 60º Putter: Ai-One 7 T CH, 34" Preferred Ball: Z-Star Diamond Pushcart: Nitron Rangefinder: Tour V5 Shift Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richk9holes Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 I'm going to try to straddle a line here, because I think a political element is being left out of the conversation. I like to leave politics out of my posts here, but as I analyze this I keep asking myself "What changed from 2019 to today?" When talk began of a "super league" to rival the PGA, Donald Trump was POTUS and was linked to the Saudis/PIF from the beginning. There's an ongoing federal probe into his involvement. I think some of the strong emotions on either side of the argument are intensified by his proximity to the story. '22 PGA Championship moving locations had a lot of reactions, most of which were telling of the political stripes of the person reacting. I'm seeing a lot of the same in the reactions to this merger. GolfSpy_BEN, Franc38 and tony@CIC 3 Quote Finding a way to turn birdies into bogeys since 1992. #TeamChunks '23 Forum Tester: Elixir Golf Ball WITB:TS2 10.5° @ 11.25° Tensei blue AV 55 R graph•917f2 15° @ 16.5° Diamana blue x5ct dialed 70 R graph•Stealth 22° Ventus red 6 (non-velo) R graph• 699u 2i 17° tgi 70 R graph•24° Tour v 90 black pvd R steel•699 6i-PW Tour 110 black pvd R steel• SM8 50°/08° @ 52°/10° SM8 stock steel• Jaws Full Toe 56°/12° DG Spinner TI steel • c series DW 2.0 slant neck stock steel•Phantom 2 gps•Tour v3 rangefinder•Elixir golf ball• Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevenhp Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 I have waited to comment after confirming that it was real and reading comments. I’ve come to the conclusion that the lawsuits and the courts had something to do with it. As far as better for golf, my take that that statement has to do with the pro tour (tv revenues, manufacturers ad and such). The USGA an R&A sets the rules of the game as well as the open championships. It doesn’t affect the average player like me. I’ve watched less golf and have never seen the LIV tour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinnman Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 Kind of feels like the PGA Tour sold out. Probably had some items in discovery that they didn’t want to be seen. Shapotomous and mardukes 2 Quote Driver: Cobra Aerojet 9* Ventus Red 5S shaft 3W: Cobra Aerojet Max Cobra LTDx 3H-5H 7-PW Callaway Rogue ST Max Elevate 85 steel shafts Wedges: Cleveland CBX zipcore steel 46*, 50*, 54*, 58* Putter: Odyssey Tri-hot 5K Rossie Ball: Titleist ProV1 or AVX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveGH7 Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 I can see this leading to another league forming and tempting away some of the pissed off PGA guys. Maybe Rory and Tiger can turn their virtual league into an actual tour? Quote Driver: Ping G425 Max ( Mitsubishi Tensei Orange 55g R) Woods: Callaway Big Bertha B23 3 Wood (RCH 55 Regular), TaylorMade Stealth 2 HD 5 Wood (Fujikura Speeder NX Red Regular) Hybrid: Titleist TSR2 5 Hybrid (Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 65 R) Irons: Callaway Apex 21 DCB (Project X IO Steel R), Wedges: Cleveland CBX Full Face 2 50, Cleveland CBX Zipcore 54, Callaway Jaws Full Face 58 Putter: Cleveland HB Soft #8P (UST All-In) Ball: Srixon Q Star Tour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albatrass Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 (edited) UNBELIEVABLE!!! Jay Monahan should be ashamed of himself for being so underhanded that he could not even tell the current members of the PGA tour what he was doing. Golf will never be the same for all aspects of the game for many years. Can hardly wait to see the new leadership roles (Norman), who they will be and how much power they will have over the member players. Sure, there will be much discussion. Edited June 7, 2023 by Albatrass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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