PGA Tour & PIF/LIV Golf Merger

[TitleistMike]

Golf is golf. Worldwide. For PGA and Brandel Chamblee to claim moral high ground was absurdity and myopic.

Only 16% of $1.6 billion annual PGA value revenue is charitable. The rest goes to players and PGA staff. 

USA interests have destroyed more lives than is know. Over reacting to a single Saudi event was grand standing and hypocrisy at its worst.

This allows for a broader bigger commercial entertainment product, think exhibitions, vs current PGA model.

 

All for it and thanks to Jon Rahm for being the sensible one through it all. Guys just earning a living.

[azstu324]

Not saying that I'm completely for or against everything happening. Definitely a wildcard for us all..

My take is that LIV wasn't gaining the popularity/viewership they'd hoped for but owns many of the players the world wants to watch regularly.. and at exorbitant price tags. PGA was losing popularity/viewership due to the field being "watered down" with names that most of us don't recognize. (Don't misunderstand that last part. It's great to see some younger hungry guys get their shot at PGA success. It's just not what the world cares about) 

So the 2 organizations squabbled themselves into a corner and this is probably their only way out. All speculation of course. I'm just a lowly schmoe trying to get by in the world. So what do I know?

Definitely good for some entertainment for the next few months. 

 

[mardukes]

54 minutes ago, Preeway said:

I too speculate that the well may have been running dry on USA sponsors with the new direction the PGAT wanted to go with designated events. Honda is done as a sponsor after 30+ years. Wouldn’t be surprised if others were going to follow suit. Taking the PIF money may have been the only financial way forward to fight off LIV. Who knows. It’s a bad look for now and loyal Tour players have every right to be pissed. 

Exactly!

It seems many do not remember Monahan saying in one of the earliest interviews that the PGATour could not withstand PIF pouring money into golf without the limits of profitability.  PGATour had a profitable business model.  PIF just sized them.  I don't get anyone suggesting the PGATour "won" this battle.  Nor how he could have better prepared dimwitted professional athletes for this outcome.  Of course, no surprise will hit me if I see a golden parachute.

And, yes, it will be interesting to see what happens to the DP USA (Honda Classic et al.)

[richk9holes]

This comment from Lydia Ko after her win and collecting $750k 

And btw, Brooks Koepka is more of a savage than @Merlin1313

[Madden B]

I don't like it, I really just though LIV was kind of dumb and I hoped that it would just go away. I didn't like how all of those guys said it wasn't about the money and I wish they would have just kind of disappeared, like they have for the last year or so. I am sad for the guys that stayed true to the PGA tour, kind of seems like they got screwed on this one. I was really enjoying not having to see or hear from Phil or Bryson or Patrick Reed or Sergio, but it seems like all those guys are going to be back now. Sad.

[Shinnman]

47 minutes ago, azstu324 said:

Not saying that I'm completely for or against everything happening. Definitely a wildcard for us all..

My take is that LIV wasn't gaining the popularity/viewership they'd hoped for but owns many of the players the world wants to watch regularly.. and at exorbitant price tags. PGA was losing popularity/viewership due to the field being "watered down" with names that most of us don't recognize. (Don't misunderstand that last part. It's great to see some younger hungry guys get their shot at PGA success. It's just not what the world cares about) 

So the 2 organizations squabbled themselves into a corner and this is probably their only way out. All speculation of course. I'm just a lowly schmoe trying to get by in the world. So what do I know?

Definitely good for some entertainment for the next few months. 

It certainly didn’t help with the Masters and the PGA Championship having a strong showing from LIV.  If LIV players tanked there, then this would have never happened.  

 

[richk9holes]

Now the field has gotten more experience at the top level at the toughest courses and on the weekends, there's no telling whether some of the LIV guys can just stroll back in and make cuts. 

If they do, it means they are performing at the top of their game and I want to see them in the field. The ones who cashed out and stopped working so hard will likely struggle on their return. That in itself may expand the reach of the game. Imagine Sergio and a host of other pros lose their status and have to play qualifiers? Now qualifiers are interesting. Some big names may end up in lesser formats and tourneys going forward, also good for expanding the game.

[Beakbryce]

Thoughts:

First, can I just say this, Shark, your 15 minutes of fame are done. Bye-Bye. You are a bitter old man who broke the Tour. No one will want to have anything to do with you.

If I was a sponsor of a "non designated event" between the US Open and The Open, I would use my exemptions to invite DJ, Brooks, Phil, and HV III. You know that tournament probably isn't getting the Sheffler, Rory, JT, Speith, Rahm group. If Monahan objects, I would tell him to bite me.

I also expect the Tour rank and file may say enough is enough. The Monahan, Tiger, Rory cabal that changed the schedule, brought out big money tournaments for the very few, was proposing no cut 80 player fields with limited opportunity to get in are going to feel the wrath of the other half that have been getting short shrift. If I was them, I would band together, kick Monahan out, vote out the merger, let the chips fall where they will. We have already heard one player telling Rory to F*** off.

I am curious how much money PIF will offer the top 20-30 pros on the Tour to get them to help get the approval of the rest of the players. No reason now not to take the money and run.

What happens when the DOJ, the EU board, don't approve the merger because it creates a monopoly? I would expect at that time to see a lot more players defect to LIV because the Tour will be in total disarray. 

Are the LIV Europeans back in the Ryder Cup?

I know Monahan is saying there will be a road back for LIV players to ask for reinstatement to the Tour but there will be sanctions of some kind. Don't believe it, LIV won, by the time the next season arrives, EVERYONE will be tired of the fight, they will be quietly reinstated somehow. Trust me on this.

 

[Kansas King]

I think I'm done watching any golf that is going to be under this new PIF umbrella corporation. Maybe I'll watch the PGA Championship and US Open but not for a while. I hate that money ruined the one sport I truly love. The saddest part is I know the whole industry will capitulate to this new entity. I would be surprised if there were any companies that stopped spending money on marketing for the PGA or if any networks would decline to cover this abomination. We're going to hear the same disgusting statements companies have said about China and now the PIF. We're going to get a lot of "it's complicated". Puke.

I'm not a perfect person and I don't have a special moral high ground. However, this is likely where I'm drawing a line. I will not purposefully watch PGA Tour events. I will not wear anything that states or promotes the PGA Tour. I will not support companies that openly support this move and/or the Saudi PIF. If that means not wearing many name brands, I can live with that. 

I know that my avoidance of the Tour won't make a difference. However, it's impossible to make a difference if I act like nothing ever happened. Golf is something I feel strongly about and this is a very disappointing timeline.

[Golf Therapy]

On 6/6/2023 at 10:32 AM, vandyland said:If I put on my tin foil hat, it may be the tour trying to avoid certain information coming out during the litigation that was set to kick off soon. 

I hadn’t considered this until I read the comment. Makes a lot of sense. Add the boatload of cash on top of that as extra incentive and of course it happened.

[Golf Therapy]

Jay needs to come out and say he couldn’t turn down the amount of money being offered and be straightforward and honest. Just like everyone wanted the LIV guys to do.

[Clay5477]

Wow. I'm stunned. I did NOT see this coming. Here's my take on the current details...

1. The PGA Tour, the DP World Tour, and the Saudi royal family Public Investment Fund, (PIF, who owns the LIV Tour), continue as they are now. Distinct organizations.

2. They are in a new, evolving "partnership" in a for-profit organization to run all professional men's golf, world-wide. Expect some monopoly questions in the near future.

3. PIF was willing to do this because the LIV tour had no legitimate sponsors, no legitimate TV coverage, and they weren't going to continue to fund this in the future. And, it ends all current litigation.

4. The PGA Tour and the DP World Tour invested "themselves" as their investment, but the LIV Tour had no value, so PIF is also putting a major cash investment into the new partnership. Billions of dollars, obviously. They are designated as the "Premier investor", whatever that means.

5. The PGA Tour, and Jay Monahan, are essentially running global golf, with PIF holding the purse strings. That's the "partnership." 

6. Norman is out.

The shocker, and this is based on what I've read, and may not be correct:

All existing members in good standing on the PGA Tour and the DP World Tour are in the new organization. However, all others, which would include current LIV members, "may apply for reinstatement", based on "objective" criteria, which is based on "current PGA Tour policies and procedures." Which means that current LIV members are NOT automatically in the new structure. Holy cow!! We all assumed they were in the new structure, kept their signing bonuses, and that all existing PGA/DP Tour members would be kicking themselves for not taking the money. May not necessarily be accurate. There may still be some LIV members who end up on the outside, which raises the question of whether or not they keep their money given that if their reinstatements are not accepted, they're no longer professional tour players, anywhere. Yikes.

The moral, ethical, human rights issues: The US and all its global allies cheerfully buy all the Saudi oil they can get, refine it into gasoline and other products, and sell it for profit. This makes US oil corporations and Saudi Arabia happy. The US and its global allies regularly sell weapons to Saudi Arabia, which makes our military corporations enormous profits, and makes them and Saudi Arabia happy. When Saudi Arabia is happy with the US and its allies, it supports our geopolitical strategies in the Middle East. The Saudi royal family, through their ARAMCO oil business, is the primary sponsor of the Ladies European Tour. The Saudi royal family owns one of the biggest soccer teams in the UK Premier League. The Saudi royal family is becoming a major player in Formula One motor sports.

All human rights concerns are trumped by enough money. Always.

 

Sorry for the long-winded post. I'm going to be really, really interested in how the "reinstatement process" is going to play out for existing LIV members.

Edited June 7, 2023 by Clay5477

[azstu324]

23 minutes ago, Shinnman said:

It certainly didn’t help with the Masters and the PGA Championship having a strong showing from LIV.  If LIV players tanked there, then this would have never happened.  

 

And without knowing, I'd be willing to bet that viewership stats were the highest they'd been in a while and not just because of the of the event.. but because of the field 

[ChuckZ]

I watched the announcement on TV yesterday.  I think the bringing together the tours is good for golf and it I felt it was going to happen.  Jay Monahan did not represent the players fairly in this.  They had supported him his stance against a merger and they had no input when it was all about the players.  He blindsided the very ones who supported him all the way.  I have always said the PGA is the I said so league and he is the I said so guy and this proved me right.  Again it was all about money and he will be getting a bigger pay check by running the for profit league that manage the three leagues.  Jay talks out of both sides of his mouth and he is in it for Jay.  I hope this works out for all the players worldwide.  Maybe bringing them all together can gain strength among the players.  Jay has shown his true colors and it green.  Even less respect than I have had in the past.  Hoping it all works out for the players.  I was for the merger, but sorry it ended up like it did.  Monahan owes the players more than how it played out.    

[ChuckZ]

32 minutes ago, Clay5477 said:

Wow. I'm stunned. I did NOT see this coming. Here's my take on the current details...

1. The PGA Tour, the DP World Tour, and the LIV Tour, continue as they are now. Distinct organizations.

2. They are in a new, evolving "partnership" in a for-profit organization to run all professional men's golf, world-wide. Expect some monopoly questions in the near future.

3. LIV was willing to do this because they had no legitimate sponsors, no legitimate TV coverage, and they weren't going to continue to fund this in the future. And, it ends all current litigation.

4. The PGA Tour and the DP World Tour invested "themselves" as their investment, but the LIV Tour had no value, so LIV is also putting a major cash investment into the new partnership. They are designated as the "Premier investor", whatever that means.

5. The PGA Tour, and Jay Monahan, are essentially running global golf, with LIV holding the purse strings. That's the "partnership." 

6. Norman is out.

The shocker, and this is based on what I've read, and may not be correct:

All existing members in good standing on the PGA Tour and the DP World Tour are in the new organization. However, all others, which would include current LIV members, "may apply for reinstatement", based on "objective" criteria, which is based on "current PGA Tour policies and procedures." Which means that current LIV members are NOT automatically in the new structure. Holy cow!! We all assumed they were in the new structure, kept their signing bonuses, and that all existing PGA/DP Tour members would be kicking themselves for not taking the money. May not necessarily be accurate. There may still be some LIV members who end up on the outside, which raises the question of whether or not they keep their money given that if their reinstatements are not accepted, they're no longer professional tour players, anywhere. Yikes.

The moral, ethical, human rights issues: The US and all its global allies cheerfully buy all the Saudi oil they can get, refine it into gasoline and other products, and sell it for profit. This makes US oil corporations and Saudi Arabia happy. The US and its global allies regularly sell weapons to Saudi Arabia, which makes our military corporations enormous profits, and makes them and Saudi Arabia happy. When Saudi Arabia is happy with the US and its allies, it supports our geopolitical strategies in the Middle East. The Saudi royal family, through their ARAMCO oil business, is the primary sponsor of the Ladies European Tour. The Saudi royal family owns one of the biggest soccer teams in the UK Premier League. The Saudi royal family is becoming a major player in Formula One motor sports.

All human rights concerns are trumped by enough money. Always.

 

Sorry for the long-winded post. I'm going to be really, really interested in how the "reinstatement process" is going to play out for existing LIV members.

Guess will know at the end of 2023.  Hopefully Jay's actions are better than his words.   

[richk9holes]

If this goes down like Succession style corporate cold-blooded as I fully expect, the next step is everyone who was prone to hyperbole and downright toxic on either side of the saga gets quietly ushered out and everyone else in the room gets offered a huge sum of money to rock the boat no longer.

[OdinSnipes414]

I had a feeling that the pga and LIV were the same entity! I’ve mentioned it before! I’ll be suprised to see the pga players respond 

[richk9holes]

And important note about the bad journalism we currently have in the world, I'd go read those LIV contracts closely to figure out how much is guaranteed and how much can be clawed back. Some of these guys don't actually have the $100s millions in their possession yet. They will be the best ambassadors for the new organization because that's how they finish earning the money.

[Shinnman]

52 minutes ago, richk9holes said:

Now the field has gotten more experience at the top level at the toughest courses and on the weekends, there's no telling whether some of the LIV guys can just stroll back in and make cuts. 

If they do, it means they are performing at the top of their game and I want to see them in the field. The ones who cashed out and stopped working so hard will likely struggle on their return. That in itself may expand the reach of the game. Imagine Sergio and a host of other pros lose their status and have to play qualifiers? Now qualifiers are interesting. Some big names may end up in lesser formats and tourneys going forward, also good for expanding the game.

Send Sergio to Q school or Korn Ferry!

[richk9holes]

Just now, Shinnman said:

Send Sergio to Q school or Korn Ferry!

Yes and a 15 minute section of Full Swing Season 2 Episode 2 to document the shame.

[Shinnman]

How much did Jay cash out?  That’s the real question.  

[RickyBobby_PR]

37 minutes ago, azstu324 said:

And without knowing, I'd be willing to bet that viewership stats were the highest they'd been in a while and not just because of the of the event.. but because of the field 

While it doesn’t account for multiple people watching one tv, clubhouses, sports bars, restaurants and streaming rating for the pga championship were down. The final round drew the lowest rating in over a decade.

 

[azstu324]

6 minutes ago, Shinnman said:

How much did Jay cash out?  That’s the real question.  

Let's just say that the nearly doubled cost of gas, groceries, and everything else, aren't going to be a problem for him. 

[Clay5477]

Very interesting analysis...
 

https://www.si.com/golf/news/with-stunning-merger-pga-commissioner-jay-monahan-has-some-explaining-to-do?utm_source=Iterable&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=morning-read-newsletter-&date=2023-06-07

[azstu324]

9 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

While it doesn’t account for multiple people watching one tv, clubhouses, sports bars, restaurants and streaming rating for the pga championship were down. The final round drew the lowest rating in over a decade.

 

Oh I definitely don't disagree with the historicality of that particular event and viewings, but I'd venture to say that over the last two years it might be one of the highest televised and followed events on the PGA. 

Again just pure speculation with no factual backing... But to me it sounds about right

[RickyBobby_PR]

44 minutes ago, azstu324 said:

Oh I definitely don't disagree with the historicality of that particular event and viewings, but I'd venture to say that over the last two years it might be one of the highest televised and followed events on the PGA. 

Again just pure speculation with no factual backing... But to me it sounds about right

It’s seen a decline in viewership for awhile with the exceptions being Phil’s win, the time during JT’s playoff and when Tiger plays. It’s not an event that draws viewership despite its major status and in some cases like this year intriguing viewing of block’s rounds or brooks Koepka’s final round 

It had all the ingredients for a recipe of success. A major, big names that left for liv that people claimed they wanted to see. A pretty historical course, excitement on the leaderboard and a good story with block yet it failed from a ratings perspective.

[Shapotomous]

@Clay5477  i think you are mostly correct in your post but i believe #5 is a contradiction.  When this is done PIF (not LIV) holds the purse strings and runs global golf not the PGA tour and whoever is commisioner at that point. 

A couple other thoughts that crossed my mind over the last day...

I think Jay ends up running the umbrella company at a huge increase in salary which explains him selling out his players so easily.  

Seven weeks in the making puts it before the PGA and takes the LIV victory out of the sphere of influence.  

Besides the $$ sellout of Jay i think the tour was afraid of the lawsuit discovery into their financials.  They probably would have won the lawsuit and lost a bigger battle from the disclosures.

[Mr_BogeyPro]

I love it! It is best for the game of golf and will make the tournaments more exciting. I was thinking during the PGA Championship that LIV should invite some of the PGA players to enter a LIV tourney. Music blaring, you can wear shorts, 3-day event, and no cuts. Let's see how the merger affects these things that have made it exciting!

[Beakbryce]

breaking news:

China, enamored with the whole sportswashing theory, formed an investment fund and it's first offer was to buy the NY YANKEES. Stay tuned as MLB reacts to this formidable new threat.

[poprocksncoke]

Statement from McNealy