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I've been inspired by two recent threads: @jlukes's swing overhaul, and @revkev's thread comparing lessons and fitting vs. self-teaching and off-the-rack clubs (these are both great threads that, if you haven't, you should go read and keep up with). To begin, I'm nowhere in jluke's class as a player. I'm a mid/high handicap player, floating right around 15. But I think I can get better. As I commented in revkev's thread, I have no objections to getting lessons and getting a fitting. I'd love to do both of those. My chief obstacle is location. I don't have an actual driving range within an hour of my home. There are no full golf stores (as far as I know) within two hours of where I live. There is a really good golf coach at a course that's an hour away, and he also does fittings. He would absolutely be my first choice, but signing up for regular lessons with a two-hour round-trip commute: the time and cost add up in a hurry. I tried to get together with him to get fitted for my G700 irons that I reviewed for MGS last summer, but we couldn't get our schedules to align. So consider me another test case for revkev's question. I'm aiming to answer the question, "How much improvement can be gained with off-the-rack clubs and self-teaching?" Here's the starting point: This is my Game Golf summary of my rounds from this past July and August, set in contrast with a 5-handicap. What immediately jumps out is that I'm loosing a ton of strokes to a single-digit off the tee and in my short game. There is certainly room for improvement in ball-striking and putting, but the low-hanging fruit is in the other categories. Why am I so bad off the tee? It's not because I spray it all over; I hit an ordinary number of fairways. It's because I hardly hit it out of my own shadow. Do you see that last column? That's embarrassing. So, my first plan is to continue the SuperSpeed training that I've been doing for a couple of months now. I've seen significant speed gains already, but because I have no way to get to a course or a range before spring (late April at best here), I'm anxious to see how the speed with translate. I'm also working on a meaningful swing overhaul, with a lot of similarities to what jlukes is describing in his thread. Here's a screen cap of a swing in my backyard from a couple of years ago: Like jlukes, I have a tendency to have a pronounced forward sway through the swing, which essentially forces me to catch up with a flip at the bottom. The early extension is visible in this video I took for the G700 review. For my part, I'm pretty sure the answer is found in wrist angles, with a corresponding emphasis on rotation and staying behind the ball. These are the moves I'm working on now. I'm also working through the content from Adam Young's The Strike Plan. I'm a big fan of Adam's work, especially the notion of turning strike into a practiced skill. How am I going to measure progress until I'm on the course? Technology! I have just recently purchased a SkyTrak, which I got for a very good price. I also have a good camera that wirelessly connects to my tablet, allowing me to look at my swing in real time. And finally, I have a Zepp swing monitor. My intention is to use my garage as a pretty high-tech self-coaching bay. The SkyTrak is going to be a big part of tightening up my short game as well. One of the built-in features is the Dave Pelz-esque wedge matrix: it allows you to chart your wedges distances for full, 3/4, 1/2, and 1/4 swings for each of the wedges in your bag. My hope is to dial these in with practice this winter, giving me much greater ability to knock shots within 100 yards to makeable putting distances. My goal for this season is ambitious. I want to drop from being ~15 handicap to somewhere in the single digits. But I believe that I have the tools that I need to accomplish this goal. And I have a community here for the support, which is also a key component. I'll be using this thread to keep everyone posted on my progress.

Hmmh. Of all the clubs and shoes I have, I don't seem to have the correct ones for this

Make it four I've never had lessons and played off the rack for a very long time. Maybe got down to an 8 or so that way. I've still never had lessons, but I have been fit several times. I do believe it's made a big difference. A bad swing is still going to be a bad result, but a good fitting can help you hit the ball well more often. So even though it's a drive, don't give up on it just yet! I will say the biggest thing that helped me go lower though was just playing more often. I used to play a handful of times a year, maybe once or twice a month when the weather was nice. Since we moved on to a course I get to play weekly and sometimes more. Just going out to play more has made by far the biggest difference in my scoring.

Also forgot to add that my local range is the best. It's where I take my lessons and do all of my practicing. With the winter program I am doing I asked the owner about the best place to buy a golf mat for my basement for practicing drills etc. He offered me one of their used mats for a fraction of the price it would cost me to buy one of the same quality. Can't wait to start practicing on it after it dries out a bit

Make it 5 18 to 5 with no lessons or even much understanding of equipment or the technicalities of the swing. I learned it all from John Jacobs basic golf book Practical golf. Since I learned about shafts and intricate technical swing motions in the last 10 years ......I got worse lol Good luck @GolfSpy MPR I'll be following, and supporting, with interest.

Okay, okay, I know three people on the forum who are self-taught single digits. And one of them (not saying who), is a little needy.

The foot spray is definitely something I've intended to do for some time now. My biggest issue is having a place to swing driver. My garage ceiling is just low enough that I clip it with the long club. Practicing outside isn't possible this time of year here (the high Friday is 2°). Practicing outside at the house in good weather concerns me, because my bad miss is the popup off the top line of the driver (with the easy potential of going over the net toward nearby homes). I may end up trying the foot spray indoors with practice balls, which I'm sure will delight my wife and my dog, in very different ways

How's this as proof of addiction issues? I herniated a disc a few weeks ago (9th time) and this one is really bad, it'll be months before I can play and that's only if surgery isn't deemed necessary. Also, I LOVE my CF16's, shot a PB -4 this season with them, (obliterating my previous PB of +1). Shot -1 too, along with a few rounds of even par. So, that all said... I bought a new set of Wilson Staff C300 Forged irons. Why? I have absolutely NO idea, LOL... I mean, I got a fantastic deal on them but price is bound to be less months from now. You know, when I can actually physically swing a club. [emoji2957]

What he said!! I'll definitely be at the booth asking Bridgestone where they are on getting these into more stores for fitting or the proposed demo program they talked about. These are irons than anyone from a single digit to 20 should seriously look at if they want a great looking iron that doesn't scream GI and is forged, but yet doesn't require you to have the ball striking skills of a blade player.

The 7 ft ceilings are pretty limiting, but it's better than nothing!

Sneaked in some SkyTrak time during lunch today. Wanted to get into the garage today, since it's a balmy 30°, with the highs dropping into single digits this weekend. As I was just doing a little practice, I brought only my driver and 8 iron. I reconfirmed that, even with a swing that exits low and left, the ceiling is just too low. Even if I can make a swing, the ceiling is always on my mind; I can't swing the driver freely in the garage. I did choke down three inches and hit some aggressive bunts, but that's not a shot I need to be practicing With the 8 iron, I did some warmup swings. The best part of having the SkyTrak is (obviously) the feedback, but especially off a mat into a tent, it is absolutely essential to know when the mat is allowing you to "get away" with a fat shot that would be punished on turf. The SkyTrak keeps you honest: without a clean strike, the ball speed drops notably. After a brief warmup, I set up a Target Practice challenge, at 155 yards (which is quite ambitious for an 8 iron). Of the six shots in the challenge, I think I scored points on 4 of them. Here's my chart: The second shot was a total fat. The spin rates remain very, very low, which is probably accurate given 1) swing speed and 2) the G700 irons. I'm pretty sure that the smash factor number (PTI, last column) can be entirely ignored. The SkyTrak doesn't directly measure club data, so if it's guessing low on swing speed, the smash factors are going to be really high. All told, I was pleased with the number of target hits, but it's clear that the strike needs work, so that I increase spin and carry and stop getting this much rollout.

Today is one of those days where I hate having to weigh in every day. Up 2.2 lbs from yesterday for no discernible reason. [emoji848] I finish my year long program in February at which point I will switch to weekly weigh ins. My guess is that I will be back down to 165 or below tomorrow. I remain below my target weight of 168. I’ve been there since mid September. I like to stay around 165 though. Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

Made it booze free for 14 days and counting. I told my wife that she may find me in the yard surrounded by beer cans on February 1st.

Lost another 1.8 this week. Ended up having to miss a few days in the gym after my low back and hips got really tight and restricted my movements. But I’m back today after some steroids. Gonna be incorporating a lot more pre and post workout stretching going forward

In my opinion, I'd say it's a combination of the colder weather, natural variation in the short term (as opposed to the long term trend), and the expected plateau, and nothing to be too concerned about. Calypso55 mentioned this being like Weight Watchers - I think that's exactly right. I know if I step on the scale every day for two weeks, my weight might go up or down as much as 3 pounds from one day to the next, and the speeds I record on any given day do the same. It's that long term gain that matters in the end. I changed things up yesterday...normally I try to alternate the days I go to the gym with the speed training days, but couldn't get in the protocol Sunday, so I went to the gym yesterday morning before work (barbell squats, overhead press w/barbell, and deadlifts, so pretty beat after that, but the elliptical just doesn't seem to make me stronger ), then did the protocol after dinner, about 12 hours after the morning workout. Definitely tired out a lot quicker than usual - I was feeling it by the time I got to the step-change swings (luckily I'm still on the first level, I would have been pretty gassed for the kneeling swings). I guess the combo of working out the same day and swinging at the end of the day. I thought that was pretty interesting to try out. On Saturday, I did another 2 hours of indoor simulated golf, and felt more confident in swinging harder than I normally would, and definitely saw more virtual yardage that before I started the protocol, at least on the drives I hit well. One drawback is using their tees, none of which let me set the ball to the height I'd use in the real world, so I was either getting a little high or low on the ball on some swings as I tried several different tees. Anyway, it's a fun couple of hours with the guys in my usual foursome.

I'll know more next week.....hopefully! So stay tuned.

Hey, I’m self taught off the rack barely single digit. If you are swinging 90-100 you are about where I am swing speed wise. I was hitting 200-210 drives on average and mostly because of high spin and angle of attack. The Cobra rep put me in a 9.5 head and had me move the ball from inside my left heel to outside my left pinkie toe. I’m still very inefficient but those 2 things gave me about 20 more yards. Sent from my iPad using MyGolfSpy

Nice! You all are inspiring me to get a hitting mat and a net for the garage. Research begins. I’ll be following along. Good luck on the journey fellow Yooper.

It's amazing how two eyes can see something different. As someone who misses left I could never game a driver that looks closed to me. Love how square the TS2 sits to my eye

End of Stage 2 Stats:

It's funny you mention the yellow cobra on the crown - I didn't really care for it either. It's wonder if the white version of the driver comes with a white logo on the crown. Dense is the perfect way to describe the sound/feel of this driver

... 3 days of driving didn't do my back any favors and I am still stiff and sore. Taking it easy and avoiding spasms but played a couple days which is enough to know I absolutely love the sound and feel of the F9. I have never had a sound which is a mid pitch thwack, not a low thud, but feel so dense. Normally the feel is a little crisper to match the sound so a perfect combo of sound and feel for me and I think many are gonna love the combo. Almost like the face holds the ball an extra millisecond before rebounding with the ball jumping off the face. I will have to wait til I can swing freely to really judge performance, hopefully within the next week or so. But so far I am impressed, and again the F9 3 wood is just sooooo long and forgiving paired with the Atmos Tour Spec Blue shaft. ... One change I have already made is white paint fill on the crown logo. The yellow was by no means distracting or unattractive but I have had a white logo on my crown for so long, it is just a comfortable look for me and easy to do as I just traced the logo with white dots. Looks like "2nd grade arts and crafts" up close but from address, it looks good and that is really all that counts:

I'm all over the place as well, but I just chalk it up to not being a robot and being able to repeat everything exactly the same each time. Sometimes it'll feel and sound like I absolutely went Mach 3 and then show 108, and others I'll feel like it wasn't as quick and be 114. I'm still in the pre-stages but I'm already seeing a consistent increase in averages. My goal is to gain 6 mph -- modest but I think doable. I'd rather under-promise and over-deliver on this project. I hit 111 with the blue club during my last training, I'll be absolutely satisfied with that being my driver speed this summer.

When I am using my iPhone to browse MGS, it's pretty much exclusively at the MIL's house. And if I'm totally bored I might pop in this place on the app there and browse for a bit. But I've found trying to post stuff into threads on the app is a giant PITA, so I've pretty much stopped even posting anything from my phone. When I am at home and am watching TV and get bored and go to MGS on my Chromebook, I always do it in the web browser, because the app on my Chromebook is completely worthless. Most of my posting comes from the Windows desktop I work on during the day, as I am posting from right now. Something about typing on a traditional keyboard, versus using my thumbs on a phone has a greater appeal to me and speeds up the BS I type here dramatically.

I’m wondering if any of our SuperSpeed users would comment. I was just all over the place in my workout - 105 one swing, 93 the next, faster lefty in some drills than righty. It was crazy. When it all fell out I had a 107 regular swing with the blue and my last 3 green swings went 108, 110, 112. Daisy told me that after swinging as fast as I could with driver on the course to that visualize and match those to my on course swing. I went “behind the ball” pictured my shot on my longest drive from Sunday and replicated that swing. It worked! Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

Meant Rehberg, but if you can get "our" Adam on video with some quotes, that'd be epic as well!!

Did a fantastic Kettlebell workout class at the gym today! Down to 9% body fat and skeletal muscle mass continues to trend up!

I just added a Pre-PGA Merchandise Show follow up review of the Bridgestone JGR HF-2 irons. It's golf season; I've seen the big boys playing in Hawaii, so that makes it so. Find the Bridgestone peeps at Orange County National next week, or find a club fitter who can fit you into a set of these beauties!

Lefty and Broke 70 please. I saw where you only wanted to do 2, but if we're allowed 3, I'd also like the Hole in One. Cool idea to show some "flair", but just the minimum amount.

@tommc23 so far so good with the inversion table. While you don't feel your vertebrae separating, I find it relaxing hanging upside down for a few minutes. I think I'll do it in the morning and at night before I go to bed.

Yep. You're in the correct place for your obsession. Or maybe it's actually the wrong place Good luck with the injury.

Here are my results through Level 2. After I started Level 2, SuperSpeed Golf sent me the Red club because I topped 90 mph with my driver, so I stopped using the Yellow club. I was getting essentially the same speeds with the Yellow and Green clubs anyway. Even though my speeds went up with clubs over Level 1 speeds with the Green and Blue clubs, my driver speed dropped a little... just like others have noticed. Curious. Last week I did the 3 sessions of Week 15, the first week of Level 3. I was going to do Week 16 this week, but the weather turned ugly, and I have to do the protocol outside. Doing the protocol in the cold is one thing, doing it in the cold with rain, sleet and snow is something else. Since I'm suspending the protocol starting next week for two weeks anyway, I decided to take another week off. So, I will resume with my second week of Level 3 when I return.

I'm not too concerned. It's like when I was active in Weight Watchers... sometimes you gain a few, but you knew that you'd be taking them off in the long run. I sent a video of my latest driver swing to Daisy. Didn't hear anything back. Had to go to an indoor range to track the results. Their radar was only one or two MPH off of the speeds on my radar (used both at the same time to compare). I did notice something about my swing mechanics when I reviewed my videos. I'm going to try to make a little change-- for the good of my actual swing, not just for the SwingSpeed trials-- but hoping it might also result in a couple of extra MPH's. RevKev, heading down to Florida next week. Not a pleasure trip, however. My brother is in very poor health. Need to visit him. Just a quick trip down and back over a couple of days, otherwise I'd see if we could have hit a few on the range together.

I’m in Maine for business right now. I’ll ask around tomorrow and see if I get any good suggestions for you. Are you flying or driving? Sent from my iPad using MyGolfSpy

We are still talking a 10 percent gain over his original SS with another jump on the horizon. Not bad! Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

That's a really solid plan. I can tell you that being a self taught single digit player is an achievable goal. I know of 2 on the forum who are self-taught single digits. @Jon Brittan and myself. I've never had a lesson and for myself, I feel that is the best path for my game. Taking a cursory look at your game and statistics, extra distance will help you immensely. You're plenty accurate and seem to have a good short game. Eliminating the "hip slide" will increase distance. By eliminating the hip slide myself, I've picked up 5mph and make much better contact. That coupled with SuperSpeed, I expect to see some distance gains and lower score. Good Luck!

I don’t have much to add but best of luck hitting single digits. On second thought, get a set of Launcher HB irons and be done with it. Sent from my iPad using MyGolfSpy

Game Golf tells me I'm hitting 55-60%. That's actually in line with what they have for a 5 handicap, but I'm 60 yards short, so the "accuracy" isn't even close to mitigating the distance. @TR1PTIK, I don't have a Trackman measurement. The SuperSpeed measurements would lead me to guess that it's going to be somewhere between 90–100. So while I am trying to increase my speed, the other factor is that my strike is very poor, so that I'm not getting efficient use out of the speed I already have.

And just think you still have the furnace, AC, water heater,...........that will be replaced in the future.....oh and I forgot washer and dryer....... The joys of home ownership. Sent from my iPad using MyGolfSpy

I am not a Pelz guy either. If you are looking for some great short game and putting reads, I highly suggest Dave Stockton. His Unconcious Putting and Unconcious Scoring books are just absolutely fantastic and really helped me simplify my wedge play and putting

Like you, I've learned a ton about the swing from Mark Crossfield. He's not everyone's cup of tea (bad British pun not totally intended), but the content is there if you want it. On the more technical side, some of the videos that Trackman Maestro has produced are very helpful. On the mental side of the game and double-bogey avoidance, I think Jon Sherman over at Practical Golf has a lot of good stuff to say. On the short game, the books by Stan Utley and James Sieckmann are really helpful. I like Pelz for a lot of information, but I have moved strongly away from how he teaches the short game swing itself.

Took me forever to find this thread --- why is this not in the Golf Equipment subforum? Anyway, I pre-ordered 4dz Srixon ZStar XV Tour Yellows with Srixon's buy 3 get 1 free promo.

Can we rename this the Flat Tires and Nightmares thread?

Nicely done. So, am I going to be the bad guy with the low score of a 70? If I had to write my stage 2 before the week 14 test it would have been in the 80-90 range, but that 1mph drop totally got me. Living in Wisconsin I also had to lower the score since not everyone will have ceilings high enough to swing during the winter months. I took last week off as I was traveling for work. Did my first session of Level 3 today and just for fun I swung my driver a few times without placing a ball down after the workout. My first full swing with the driver came in at 115, a full 5 mph over my average speed at the end of Stage 2. I really wish I could get outside to test this out a little more. I also did a half swing that came in at 113 mph versus my 115 full swing. Guess I won't have to worry about the Kinematic ASD in week 20. So I got that goin' for me, which is nice.

Wow surorised to see so many on the app. Other than Jlukes comment about Data. What are the reasons for using the app. GSwag. I use Firefox on my iPhone and posting text and photos are a breeze. But I do understand your desire for a full keyboard and screen.

Good luck. I'll be following along with great interest.

This is a perfect example of why Ping is Ping and Wilson is Wilson. Ping doesn’t want their products in people’s bags with the badges falling off. They will gladly fix it free of charge so the brands durability or quality isn’t reflected upon negatively. Wilson on the other hand, doesn’t even do repairs or can’t even send the OP new badges. If I saw a year old set of clubs in someone’s bag and the badges were already falling off, well, I wouldn’t even consider them next equipment purchase. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Very impressed with the F9. I hit the 9 degree head with the heavy weight forward. Hitting frozen range balls isnt the best way to get a feel for a driver, but it felt really good. Loved the sound of it. Even at 9 degrees with the weight forward it still had plenty of launch. What I truly loved was the Fuji Atmos Black TS shaft in it. Felt so good. I can't wait until my fitting at Club Champ on Friday where I can get some actual numbers with the F9 (and try the Atmos in my TS2!) I will provide much more information after my fitting on Friday.

A lovely time on the range followed by a quick nine: had six of these drives on the course today: I know this may look like nothing to many of you but my average driver SS on this device in September was 88. Today it was nearly 95. I averaged almost 240 today. That’s what I averaged off the tee when I was a 1. I’m pretty pumped right now. There’s lots of things I still do well on the golf course. A tad more distance could go a long, long way. Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

My average on this device prior to starting SuperSpeed was 88. So 96 is an 8 mph gain - I actually averaged 94.7 today. My goal was to get to 95 on this device. I've adjust that goal. Barring issues I should have my stage 2 review up in an hour. Starting to work on importing it - now!