Blade irons for practice?

[G56788]

1 hour ago, chisag said:

 

... Here is the thing with all these threads that I have seen for too many years to count. I have yet to see someone "ask" about playing MB's or training with MB's that read the comments and ended with "OK, after reading what everyone replied, I am not gonna play or practice with MB's. As a mid/high index player I am gonna stick with something more forgiving". It is why I have always felt 99% of these posts are just looking for validation. And I see MB's in the used sections of golf stores that have ball marks completely off the grooves toe side and think "another forum member succumbs to the allure of MB's". 

... There should be no need to repeat this but of course I will. Play/practice with the most forgiving irons you can effectively play. But if you really want to scratch the itch to play or practice with MB's go right ahead. It's your game and your money and nothing wrong with exploring options and trying any and everything you want, but again like the owner of the used MB set with wear marks the size of a dollar bill and not a dime, don't p!ss on my leg and tell me it is raining. 

I recently joined this forum and I haven’t had the benefit of reading the prior threads on this topic. My original post asked what everyone thought about an idea posed in an article I had read. The idea made sense in broad strokes, but never having tried it, I lacked the knowledge and experience to determine whether it would be beneficial to my game. The comments on both sides have been helpful to identify the benefits and pitfalls of trying this idea and defining how I could judge success/failure given the variables at play. This is no different than reading the Most Wanted or Forum Testing results when considering a new piece of equipment. My most recent post was an attempt at humor to keep things lighthearted, and because this forum is supposed to be enjoyable. 

[GolfSpy_APH]

8 minutes ago, Golfer56744 said:

I recently joined this forum and I haven’t had the benefit of reading the prior threads on this topic. My original post asked what everyone thought about an idea posed in an article I had read. The idea made sense in broad strokes, but never having tried it, I lacked the knowledge and experience to determine whether it would be beneficial to my game. The comments on both sides have been helpful to identify the benefits and pitfalls of trying this idea and defining how I could judge success/failure given the variables at play. This is no different than reading the Most Wanted or Forum Testing results when considering a new piece of equipment. My most recent post was an attempt at humor to keep things lighthearted, and because this forum is supposed to be enjoyable. 

The subject which was asked is one I am sure many are curious about and it is good that it was asked. Often earlier threads on this topic and others will get lost in the weeds of thousands of posts and threads so bringing this back to light is well worth while to have the discussion. Even if it has been discussed before... that is okay!

Another thing for all of us to remember is that there are many new to the forum and finding new things (such as yourself) and we want you as well as anyone else to feel comfortable asking whatever question you have. Of course we encourage reading prior threads, but sometimes they can be harder to find as mentioned or maybe old enough that they aren't as relevant. 

I am glad you found answers or responses that are useful on both sides to help you with the entire though process. 

In addition with golf being such a unique game for each individual all will have different thoughts, methods or strategies on how to improve. It is a big reason why we are all here to discuss them even if we feel passionate about one method vs another. 

I can only hope that we have many more of these questions asked from new members that help bring more conversation and eyes to the forum to help them find the answers they are looking for (good or bad) with such a wealth of experience and knowledge we have amongst all of our existing members and members to come!

[GolfSpy_SHARK]

4 hours ago, cnosil said:

This made me laugh

 

I mean....it could work.....tryin to squeeze in those suckers every day might convince me to do so!

[GolfSpy_SHARK]

21 minutes ago, Golfer56744 said:

I recently joined this forum and I haven’t had the benefit of reading the prior threads on this topic. My original post asked what everyone thought about an idea posed in an article I had read. The idea made sense in broad strokes, but never having tried it, I lacked the knowledge and experience to determine whether it would be beneficial to my game. The comments on both sides have been helpful to identify the benefits and pitfalls of trying this idea and defining how I could judge success/failure given the variables at play. This is no different than reading the Most Wanted or Forum Testing results when considering a new piece of equipment. My most recent post was an attempt at humor to keep things lighthearted, and because this forum is supposed to be enjoyable. 

Dont be hesitant to ask the question. I think it was a great question and worth, clearly, a good discussion.

[chisag]

8 hours ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

The subject which was asked is one I am sure many are curious about and it is good that it was asked. Often earlier threads on this topic and others will get lost in the weeds of thousands of posts and threads so bringing this back to light is well worth while to have the discussion. Even if it has been discussed before... that is okay!

Another thing for all of us to remember is that there are many new to the forum and finding new things (such as yourself) and we want you as well as anyone else to feel comfortable asking whatever question you have. Of course we encourage reading prior threads, but sometimes they can be harder to find as mentioned or maybe old enough that they aren't as relevant. 

I am glad you found answers or responses that are useful on both sides to help you with the entire though process. 

In addition with golf being such a unique game for each individual all will have different thoughts, methods or strategies on how to improve. It is a big reason why we are all here to discuss them even if we feel passionate about one method vs another. 

I can only hope that we have many more of these questions asked from new members that help bring more conversation and eyes to the forum to help them find the answers they are looking for (good or bad) with such a wealth of experience and knowledge we have amongst all of our existing members and members to come!

 

....  "we want you as well as anyone else to feel comfortable asking whatever question you have.

... This statement should always be true, in life as well as a golf forum. But especially this golf forum. That said, MB's making you a better ball striker and legendary ball strikers that are mid to even high index players but drive or putt poorly has been going on like the Hatfields and McCoy's on other forums. 

... Talking to other instructors, professional fitters and especially VP's of club Engineering almost all universally think MB's are a bad idea for any reason other than you love them and want to play them. Kevin Na among many other Pros have stated they aren't good enough ball strikers to play with MB's so why would an Am think they could help their game or much worse, they somehow can excel with irons that most Pro's say they aren't good enough to play. Fwiw, many here know I have a set of Z Forged MB's I play several times a year because they are fun to play and remind me why my gamers are more forgiving Player irons.

... But when you ask forum members what they think, they are probably going to tell you. As someone that taught golf, loves golf and golf equipment I enjoy sharing my knowledge and helping others. Writing reviews for so may years and talking with both Marketing and Engineers whose sole job is making clubs easier to hit and improve players ability to play at their highest level as well as increasing their enjoyment of both playing and using their equipment. To be fair I have never asked about MB's and I can unequivocally state none have ever brought up MB's. Only golf forum members. 

... But most importantly as Lacassem said, everyone should not hesitate asking any equipment question and if I made Golfer56744 feel uncomfortable or not welcome here, I sincerely apologize because that was most definitely not my intention. I just feel very strongly about this subject. 

[GolfSpy_APH]

3 hours ago, chisag said:

 

....  "we want you as well as anyone else to feel comfortable asking whatever question you have.

... This statement should always be true, in life as well as a golf forum. But especially this golf forum. That said, MB's making you a better ball striker and legendary ball strikers that are mid to even high index players but drive or putt poorly has been going on like the Hatfields and McCoy's on other forums. 

... Talking to other instructors, professional fitters and especially VP's of club Engineering almost all universally think MB's are a bad idea for any reason other than you love them and want to play them. Kevin Na among many other Pros have stated they aren't good enough ball strikers to play with MB's so why would an Am think they could help their game or much worse, they somehow can excel with irons that most Pro's say they aren't good enough to play. Fwiw, many here know I have a set of Z Forged MB's I play several times a year because they are fun to play and remind me why my gamers are more forgiving Player irons.

... But when you ask forum members what they think, they are probably going to tell you. As someone that taught golf, loves golf and golf equipment I enjoy sharing my knowledge and helping others. Writing reviews for so may years and talking with both Marketing and Engineers whose sole job is making clubs easier to hit and improve players ability to play at their highest level as well as increasing their enjoyment of both playing and using their equipment. To be fair I have never asked about MB's and I can unequivocally state none have ever brought up MB's. Only golf forum members. 

... But most importantly as Lacassem said, everyone should not hesitate asking any equipment question and if I made Golfer56744 feel uncomfortable or not welcome here, I sincerely apologize because that was most definitely not my intention. I just feel very strongly about this subject. 

There will always be those who are passionate or have strong feelings about a subject (goodness just look at the LIV thread ... Or better don't!) and I am glad you have shared yours. 

Fwiw I'm in the same camp as you believing it would do more harm than good. 

Altho i browse on other forums I rarely post and understandably so my focus is here and haven't seen this topic on others (or i simply haven't looked hard enough). 

I do kinda wonder where this idea originated...

[G56788]

9 hours ago, chisag said:

... But when you ask forum members what they think, they are probably going to tell you.

As it should be. I am glad that everyone was willing to share their opinion, and I had no idea when I posted that the topic was so divisive. I am just not sure why some chose to question my motivations for asking or assumed that I was seeking to validate an opinion I had already formed. If someone thinks an OP won’t consider a response or is otherwise insincere, why post a response? 

Fwiw, I am not inclined to try this idea at the moment because I feel my time is better spent working on grip, stance, ball position, etc. A blade isn’t going to fix my current tendency to hit my irons a bit heavy. Though based on the responses in the thread, I think hitting a blade in practice could have some benefit under the right circumstances. We will see. I’m half-tempted to design a test of this theory to see what the data says, or, at the very least, buy the set of Hogan Apex II irons I found for cheap and compare them to my current Apex 21s in a manner similar to the MGS Retro Golf videos. Mostly because I think it would be fun. 
 

Anyway, apologies accepted. Let’s get back to talking golf. 

[chisag]

8 hours ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

Altho i browse on other forums I rarely post and understandably so my focus is here and haven't seen this topic on others (or i simply haven't looked hard enough). I do kinda wonder where this idea originated...

 

2 hours ago, Golfer56744 said:

I had no idea when I posted that the topic was so divisive. I am just not sure why some chose to question my motivations for asking or assumed that I was seeking to validate an opinion I had already formed. If someone thinks an OP won’t consider a response or is otherwise insincere, why post a response? 

I’m half-tempted to design a test of this theory to see what the data says, or, at the very least, buy the set of Hogan Apex II irons I found for cheap and compare them to my current Apex 21s in a manner similar to the MGS Retro Golf videos. Mostly because I think it would be fun. 

... It is an absolute staple topic at wrx and comes up at least once a month and has for about 20 years now and has caused many threads to be shut down by Mods when it gets too contentious. Several have been banned or given a time out. Will MB's make me a better ball striker? I am a mid index can I play MB's? Should I practice with MB's? Are MB's harder to hit? I play GI's will MB's lower my index? And on and on. I have probably put 10 folks on ignore over the years because they get arrogant, snarky and dismissive. And because that place is so pro MB's I have never seen an OP listen to any of the negatives and it can be clear in many cases they aren't asking for opinions, just justification to use MB's. Again I have no issue with anyone playing MB's or wanting to play MB's but really hate to see golfers sincerely looking to improve get set back in their progress because MB zealots think MB's are the only irons anyone should be using and try to convince everyone they should too. And to be fair some SGI advocates get equally combative. 

... Thankfully it only pops up here about once every two years because most here are interested in playing better golf and understand technology is their friend. As always the question with any equipment is how much tech do you need or want at your level of play, and the answer of course is different for every player. But I like to use the LPGA as an example where yardages and distances hit are more similar to forum members than the PGA, although we certainly have some long hitters here. The difference between them and Ams is level of ball striking and you just don't see MB's on the LPGA Tour, with the exception of 2 players. 

... That said, testing a theory for fun and curiosity sounds like an interesting idea if it truly interests you. 

[MacTourney]

21 hours ago, Golfer56744 said:

I recently joined this forum and I haven’t had the benefit of reading the prior threads on this topic. My original post asked what everyone thought about an idea posed in an article I had read. The idea made sense in broad strokes, but never having tried it, I lacked the knowledge and experience to determine whether it would be beneficial to my game. The comments on both sides have been helpful to identify the benefits and pitfalls of trying this idea and defining how I could judge success/failure given the variables at play. This is no different than reading the Most Wanted or Forum Testing results when considering a new piece of equipment. My most recent post was an attempt at humor to keep things lighthearted, and because this forum is supposed to be enjoyable. 

If you want to go full tilt boogie on blade information from both playing professionals and blade purist amateurs doing a 'blade' search at Advanced Ball Striking forum will produce just about any known blade artifact,  and maybe some unknown. 

[GolfSpy TCB]

1 hour ago, chisag said:

.. Thankfully it only pops up here about once every two years because most here are interested in playing better golf and understand technology is their friend.

I want to argue with you @Chisag, I really do.  I want to preach about all the advantages gained from hitting a pure shot with a forged hunk of metal with no cavity and little to no offset.  I want to argue that I can work the ball around, over and under any obstacle in my way with the ultimate in precision irons.  I REALLY WANT TO. 

But I can't.  I have to agree with everything you, and others with similar comments are saying. 

My initial comment in this thread talked about how I employ the use of my blades in my practice... while hinting at the benefits... ok, maybe overtly commenting on the benefits of my approach. 

But the reality is.. As much as I want to convince you, the other members and even more so... myself... that putting blades in my bag for ANY length of time make me a better striker of the ball and I do it to improve my game.... I can't say that and look at myself in the mirror. 

I do it because I like it.  I like it for whatever reason I do.  Blades are appealing to my eye, the feel of a well struck blade is second to none, most certainly an amount of ego involved in that enjoyment.... do I have a shred of proof that I am a better ball striker because of it?   no.   Soul searching as I have a tendency to do when I am laying awake at night wondering if I am being truly honest with myself about my game and how to improve it..... in the quiet of a dark room I can admit... I am better off with game improvement irons.  In the light of day, and the sun shining off the back of a blade... things get hinky...  but always in the back of my mind is a screaming voice... "you would be a better scorer if you accepted technology as your friend".  I don't use an abacus at work, I rarely use a calculator, I use a computer... why is golf so different (well, for one reason... a beautifully crafted blade iron is much more exciting to show off than an abacus... but I digress).  

So, as much as I like... no.... LOVE the many aspects of swinging a blade.... I hold my hat in my hand to say that I am better off practicing and playing with the most technology I can get to help my golf shots and my inconsistencies in swinging the golf club as a mediocre amateur golf player.  How do I know.... I put GI's in my bag this last summer (see my bag below), and my 7 handicap turned into a 3.  Anecdotal?  Maybe.  Practicing with purpose and a few lessons... most assuredly.  Saving an errant swing now and then with technology - without question.

My MP68's and Mizuno Pro 221's are looking at me from the corner of my office with tears in their eyes.  It has been a good run my friends.  I will find a nice farm in the country for you to run and play.  

 

[chisag]

42 minutes ago, Golfspy_TCB said:

I want to argue with you @Chisag, I really do.  I want to preach about all the advantages gained from hitting a pure shot with a forged hunk of metal with no cavity and little to no offset.  I want to argue that I can work the ball around, over and under any obstacle in my way with the ultimate in precision irons.  I REALLY WANT TO. 

But I can't.  I have to agree with everything you, and others with similar comments are saying. 

My initial comment in this thread talked about how I employ the use of my blades in my practice... while hinting at the benefits... ok, maybe overtly commenting on the benefits of my approach. 

But the reality is.. As much as I want to convince you, the other members and even more so... myself... that putting blades in my bag for ANY length of time make me a better striker of the ball and I do it to improve my game.... I can't say that and look at myself in the mirror. 

I do it because I like it.  I like it for whatever reason I do.  Blades are appealing to my eye, the feel of a well struck blade is second to none, most certainly an amount of ego involved in that enjoyment.... do I have a shred of proof that I am a better ball striker because of it?   no.   Soul searching as I have a tendency to do when I am laying awake at night wondering if I am being truly honest with myself about my game and how to improve it..... in the quiet of a dark room I can admit... I am better off with game improvement irons.  In the light of day, and the sun shining off the back of a blade... things get hinky...  but always in the back of my mind is a screaming voice... "you would be a better scorer if you accepted technology as your friend".  I don't use an abacus at work, I rarely use a calculator, I use a computer... why is golf so different (well, for one reason... a beautifully crafted blade iron is much more exciting to show off than an abacus... but I digress).  

So, as much as I like... no.... LOVE the many aspects of swinging a blade.... I hold my hat in my hand to say that I am better off practicing and playing with the most technology I can get to help my golf shots and my inconsistencies in swinging the golf club as a mediocre amateur golf player.  How do I know.... I put GI's in my bag this last summer (see my bag below), and my 7 handicap turned into a 3.  Anecdotal?  Maybe.  Practicing with purpose and a few lessons... most assuredly.  Saving an errant swing now and then with technology - without question.

My MP68's and Mizuno Pro 221's are looking at me from the corner of my office with tears in their eyes.  It has been a good run my friends.  I will find a nice farm in the country for you to run and play.  

 

 

... ^ Early nomination for post of the year.