Crowd Sourced Club Fitting - Can we fix me?

[walkerdb7]

Accidentally sort of hijacked the most wanted driver thread...

Recently did a fitting and hit the Smoke line, Ping Max, TM Max, and Cobra X. I am brand agnostic and will play anything that works. However, if two clubs are very similar, I might have some qualitative factors like "look at address" or "will I be tempted to upgrade this club with the next release", haha, which could factor in.

I am a very inconsistent golfer. I take lessons and work on my game. Some days it clicks and I go low. To the point where my good rounds are statistical outliers based on the USGA's opinion...  I have a 2 way miss when I am playing bad, the wheels fall off, and I struggle keep the score in double digits. When I am playing well, the driver is launching high. When I am playing bad, I am hitting unintentional stingers.

I have Arccos and a MLM2 Pro, so I have a pretty good idea about real world data for game.

I am a 12 index currently. I play 25-30 rounds a year. I play different tees at my home club depending on who I am playing with.

Blues - 7193 / 75.9 / 148

Hybrids - 6873 / 74.4 / 142

My dream in life would be to find a driver that is 10% straighter sort of thing. Would help avoid bad drives going OB or into a Hazard. In a perfect world, I would like to eliminate the left side of the golf course. That is what I went into my last fitting trying to maximize, what is gonna save me a couple shots a round...

@cnosil and @Marlin Dave asked some questions about my Qi10 Max data from recent fitting. I wanted to expand on their ideas and see if anyone had some creative ideas to further tune the equipment to maximize it's performance. Although asking about distance might feel contradictory and  I want to hit more fairways, I also strongly believe in Decade golf. The closer you are to the hole always makes achieving a lower score possible...

Anyone have some creative ideas to try with equipment? I'd be down to order a new shaft or something and do some DIY fitting comparisons at a local trackman studio. Or maybe, go hit the Ping again if that is truly a better mouse trap? That's the one frustrating thing to me about fittings? As an inconsistent player, they are a snap shot of that day as opposed to what's gonna be best for 10 rounds.

I switched LA Golf shafts in my irons and those made a big difference with my launch conditions with the same heads. I tried that in my fitting and it was the second place to the HZRDUS black I ended up with... Do I try the like High launch version in an X flex instead of the Mid Launch in a S flex?

Final fitting swings

Gapping session indoors

 

Edited March 14 by walkerdb7

[cnosil]

18 minutes ago, walkerdb7 said:

Accidentally sort of hijacked the most wanted driver thread...

Recently did a fitting and hit the Smoke line, Ping Max, TM Max, and Cobra X. I am brand agnostic and will play anything that works. However, if two clubs are very similar, I might have some qualitative factors like "look at address" or "will I be tempted to upgrade this club with the next release", haha, which could factor in.

I am a very inconsistent golfer. I take lessons and work on my game. Some days it clicks and I go low. To the point where my good rounds are statistical outliers based on the USGA's opinion...  I have a 2 way miss when I am playing bad, the wheels fall off, and I struggle keep the score in double digits. When I am playing well, the driver is launching high. When I am playing bad, I am hitting unintentional stingers.

I have Arccos and a MLM2 Pro, so I have a pretty good idea about real world data for game.

I am a 12 index currently. I play 25-30 rounds a year. I play different tees at my home club depending on who I am playing with.

Blues - 7193 / 75.9 / 148

Hybrids - 6873 / 74.4 / 142

My dream in life would be to find a driver that is 10% straighter sort of thing. Would help avoid bad drives going OB or into a Hazard. In a perfect world, I would like to eliminate the left side of the golf course. That is what I went into my last fitting trying to maximize, what is gonna save me a couple shots a round...

@cnosil and @Marlin Dave asked some questions about my Qi10 Max data from recent fitting. I wanted to expand on their ideas and see if anyone had some creative ideas to further tune the equipment to maximize it's performance. Although asking about distance might feel contradictory and  I want to hit more fairways, I also strongly believe in Decade golf. The closer you are to the hole always makes achieving a lower score possible...

Anyone have some creative ideas to try with equipment? I'd be down to order a new shaft or something and do some DIY fitting comparisons at a local trackman studio. Or maybe, go hit the Ping again if that is truly a better mouse trap? That's the one frustrating thing to me about fittings? As an inconsistent player, they are a snap shot of that day as opposed to what's gonna be best for 10 rounds.

I switched LA Golf shafts in my irons and those made a big difference with my launch conditions with the same heads. I tried that in my fitting and it was the second place to the HZRDUS black I ended up with... Do I try the like High launch version in an X flex instead of the Mid Launch in a S flex?

Final fitting swings

Gapping session indoors

 

You should post your driver configuration so people know what you are playing.  
 

but based on the fact that you hit down and are playing a 12* loft driver there probably isn’t much more to optimize unless you change your swing.   Other than missing the sweet spot by a little I think you are at optimal with your driver.  

[walkerdb7]

49 minutes ago, cnosil said:

You should post your driver configuration so people know what you are playing.  
 

but based on the fact that you hit down and are playing a 12* loft driver there probably isn’t much more to optimize unless you change your swing.   Other than missing the sweet spot by a little I think you are at optimal with your driver.  

Assumed that was the case, but I trust "the wisdom of the crowd" and I was curious if there was a niche idea anyone had or like a 12 deg 10k max or something, haha.

Current Driver from fitting:

TM Qi10 Max - HZRDUS Black 60 S - 10.5+ 2 clicks

Prior driver specs and data...

Callaway Epic Max LS - HZRDUS Smoke iM10 - 10 deg + 1 loft.

Edited March 14 by walkerdb7

[Hook DeLoft]

I'm afraid I agree with @cnosil.  Of course, a different shaft might give you a different feel that would result in an unconscious change to your action that results in more consistency, but then you are back to your basic issue, which is a fitting is only a snap shot.  Ask your instructor if working on changing your angle of attack is a good idea. 

[walkerdb7]

1 hour ago, Hook DeLoft said:

I'm afraid I agree with @cnosil.  Of course, a different shaft might give you a different feel that would result in an unconscious change to your action that results in more consistency, but then you are back to your basic issue, which is a fitting is only a snap shot.  Ask your instructor if working on changing your angle of attack is a good idea. 

Yup, completely agree this might be the answer. to your point about actions changing, I do think confidence plays a major role in playing well. Throwing up a hail mary I guess to see if there was a wild idea to give it more launch, which would also lead to more confidence.

One question... how much does ball speed matter? I see my old driver looks 2-3 mph faster and yet it does not go further?

[cnosil]

13 minutes ago, walkerdb7 said:

One question... how much does ball speed matter? I see my old driver looks 2-3 mph faster and yet it does not go further?

Lower launch and too little spin.  

[Hook DeLoft]

Hard to say from the tables you posted.  I may be overlooking it, but I only see side dispersion on one of the drivers.  I would expect the one with more curve to carry less.

[walkerdb7]

3 minutes ago, Hook DeLoft said:

Hard to say from the tables you posted.  I may be overlooking it, but I only see side dispersion on one of the drivers.  I would expect the one with more curve to carry less.

I am not a trackman expert, so the data that was emailed it to me is what I have.

The Qi10 Max had very consistent dispersion and I couldn't really hit it left. On 430 10k mishits, they did go left and that's why the Qi10 won. I am not sure if that was fact over a larger sample size or a characteristic of the day.

Here is the Qi10 Max from the gapping day

Here is the Qi 10 Max from the fitting day

[Shapotomous]

I would suggest you try a natural 12* driver rather than moving the 10.5* two clicks.  Adding loft closes the face and you mentioned wanting to eliminate the left side of the course.  

[RickyBobby_PR]

I would spray your face with foot powder spray and see where you are making contact. It’s probably sporadic across the face.

If you are still struggling with face control and path control which is looks like with the variation in the spin and height, I would consider a new instructor, or maybe look at how you are practicing.

I haven’t and not going to go back and look at the most wanted thread so not sure where you fit but a good fitter is going to be able to find a setup that reduces the miss and keep or gain distance. I would suggest finding a reputable fitter. If you choose to go it alone and do testing then search diy driver tuneup and follow that.

Changjng shafts may improve things or they may make it worse. Head and loft are easier and quicker way to try to fix launch and spin compared to shafts

[walkerdb7]

16 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

I would spray your face with foot powder spray and see where you are making contact. It’s probably sporadic across the face.

If you are still struggling with face control and path control which is looks like with the variation in the spin and height, I would consider a new instructor, or maybe look at how you are practicing.

I haven’t and not going to go back and look at the most wanted thread so not sure where you fit but a good fitter is going to be able to find a setup that reduces the miss and keep or gain distance. I would suggest finding a reputable fitter. If you choose to go it alone and do testing then search diy driver tuneup and follow that.

Changjng shafts may improve things or they may make it worse. Head and loft are easier and quicker way to try to fix launch and spin compared to shafts

I just did a fitting. This beat my prior club and I am not upset with the fitting. I think fitting is a difficult situation because I am not consistent and someone is watching me hit for 90 mins. I would imagine people on the website go down some very deep and strange rabbit holes. That is where my post stemmed from, maybe someone had a crazy shaft set up to try.

I know my issues stem from mechanics, but if swinging better were easy... I would have figured that out long ago.

Here is side by side the day of the fitting.

"Old" Callaway

Taylormade

I will try the face spray and see, that's a good test I have never done that. Will be interesting to see if I have consistent miss or not.

[walkerdb7]

1 hour ago, Shapotomous said:

I would suggest you try a natural 12* driver rather than moving the 10.5* two clicks.  Adding loft closes the face and you mentioned wanting to eliminate the left side of the course.  

Is the TM independent for Lie / Loft? It does not look closed at all.

However, until the other day, I didn't know they made a 12 deg head. I am sort of curios why I don't have that either... I don't think I hit that. Is a click not a full degree or something? Like is it .5 clicks and I am only at 11 deg?

[Shapotomous]

I believe a click is 3/4*, can someone confirm or correct this? 

If so then 10.5* to start plus 2(.75) clicks gets you to 12*

[IndyBonzo]

You may want to try a relatively high launching but stable lower flex shaft if you want more distance.  I am a huge fan of the ACCRA FX 3.0 140 M0, which is in my gamer (for now?).  It is technically a senior/ladies flex shaft but does not feel like it at all.  At all.  You can find YT videos about it being similar to the Autoflex, and less $$$.

If you really want to go down that rabbit hole go read the Otto-Phlex thread here.  We will see you in a couple weeks when you climb back out.  Ha.  
 

Best of luck on your search!

[cnosil]

34 minutes ago, walkerdb7 said:

Is the TM independent for Lie / Loft? It does not look closed at all.

However, until the other day, I didn't know they made a 12 deg head. I am sort of curios why I don't have that either... I don't think I hit that. Is a click not a full degree or something? Like is it .5 clicks and I am only at 11 deg?

Page 26-28 of this should help you:  https://www.taylormadegolf.com/on/demandware.static/-/Sites-tmag-custom-catalog-us/default/v1582967710268/pdf/Custom_Shafts.pdf

2 clicks from standard should be

3º CLOSED +1.5º LOFT 1.25º UP LIE ANGLE +300 RPM

Edited March 15 by cnosil

[RickyBobby_PR]

1 hour ago, walkerdb7 said:

I just did a fitting. This beat my prior club and I am not upset with the fitting. I think fitting is a difficult situation because I am not consistent and someone is watching me hit for 90 mins. I would imagine people on the website go down some very deep and strange rabbit holes. That is where my post stemmed from, maybe someone had a crazy shaft set up to try.

I know my issues stem from mechanics, but if swinging better were easy... I would have figured that out long ago.

Here is side by side the day of the fitting.

"Old" Callaway

Taylormade

I will try the face spray and see, that's a good test I have never done that. Will be interesting to see if I have consistent miss or not.

A good fitter is going to be able to deal with some of the inconsistency. Gatehr information about your typical ball flight, your typical miss, your big miss. Use that along with what the ball flight with the gamer and each setup. Use your input about feel, what your eye sees, etc to make adjustments.

Your swing itself is consistent it’s the compensations you make each swing and how consistent you can keep them. This is where most amateurs misunderstand things. They thing it’s the swing and try to adjust the swing rather than understanding they didn’t make the same compensation. Kind of when you hear or read about one’s timing being off on a certain day. 
 

[walkerdb7]

1 hour ago, cnosil said:

Page 26-28 of this should help you:  https://www.taylormadegolf.com/on/demandware.static/-/Sites-tmag-custom-catalog-us/default/v1582967710268/pdf/Custom_Shafts.pdf

2 clicks from standard should be

3º CLOSED +1.5º LOFT 1.25º UP LIE ANGLE +300 RPM

Interesting. I consider myself knowledgeable about what’s the market, but nuances about the adaptors are beyond my knowledge.
 

Interesting there limitations in the the adaptors still, thought they would have solved that by now. I’d assume some people want/need loft and not a closed face. 

[cnosil]

7 hours ago, walkerdb7 said:

Interesting there limitations in the the adaptors still, thought they would have solved that by now. I’d assume some people want/need loft and not a closed face. 

You might find this interesting. 

 

[walkerdb7]

10 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

A good fitter is going to be able to deal with some of the inconsistency. Gatehr information about your typical ball flight, your typical miss, your big miss. Use that along with what the ball flight with the gamer and each setup. Use your input about feel, what your eye sees, etc to make adjustments.

Your swing itself is consistent it’s the compensations you make each swing and how consistent you can keep them. This is where most amateurs misunderstand things. They thing it’s the swing and try to adjust the swing rather than understanding they didn’t make the same compensation. Kind of when you hear or read about one’s timing being off on a certain day. 
 

Based on the data, I think the fitter did a good job? Does any of the data you see highlight something I’m overlooking or not tech savvy enough to understand?
I said I didn’t want to go left and think we minimized that. Based on the fitting, the Max out performed my Callaway?

trying to better understand your comment about the amateurs and compensations, are you saying that swing changes are effectively just permanent compensations, which are never really permanent?

[Micah T]

@walkerdb7 what’s your tee height? I didn’t look at the most wanted thread, but if you’re hitting down, those numbers are pretty optimal. If you have an old driver, you could practice teeing it up higher until you get comfortable with it. You’ll never maximize your speed unless you at least get neutral with your AoA.  I don’t hit up much on my driver either, and use a 10.5 static loft driver. 

[RickyBobby_PR]

3 hours ago, walkerdb7 said:

Based on the data, I think the fitter did a good job? Does any of the data you see highlight something I’m overlooking or not tech savvy enough to understand?
I said I didn’t want to go left and think we minimized that. Based on the fitting, the Max out performed my Callaway?

trying to better understand your comment about the amateurs and compensations, are you saying that swing changes are effectively just permanent compensations, which are never really permanent?

The data is incomplete and without a swing also doesn’t allow me to see what’s actually going on.

Seeing ball flight helps too. Dont know what your face to path looks like. What your fath is, what your face angle is.

theres still a wide variance in some of the data which is probably more swing issue than club issue.

all golfers including the pros have some sort of compensation in their swing, the better golfers are able to control those and make them more repeatable from swing to swing.

all of us regular golfers will have a variance in our compensations and things like rest, energy levels and so on can have an effect on how we are moving and this how well we can repeat our compensations for where the club is. It’s why you will see people say they played better once they got warmed up, or why some will have worse back 9s because they got more tired and couldn’t repeat their compensations.

The way we swing doesn’t change from swing to swing. Those who whip the club inside get flat will typically get steep and over the top. They will have their normal ball flight for that shot then there will be their miss or big miss. The misses and big miss come from not being able to repeat the things they do to hit their normal shot. 
 

Many thing it’s their swing itself changes but it’s their ability to repeat whatever it is they do to hit their normal shot. Some also look at ball flight and start to change things to fix it from shot to shot and do it because Rey don’t understand what happened. Someone who usually has an open face or a path the causes a slice lines up slightly different or they rotate the face closed and now hit a hook will thing it’s the swing and to avoid that shot so they adjust something then end up with a totally different ball flight 

[walkerdb7]

10 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

The data is incomplete and without a swing also doesn’t allow me to see what’s actually going on.

Seeing ball flight helps too. Dont know what your face to path looks like. What your fath is, what your face angle is.

theres still a wide variance in some of the data which is probably more swing issue than club issue.

all golfers including the pros have some sort of compensation in their swing, the better golfers are able to control those and make them more repeatable from swing to swing.

all of us regular golfers will have a variance in our compensations and things like rest, energy levels and so on can have an effect on how we are moving and this how well we can repeat our compensations for where the club is. It’s why you will see people say they played better once they got warmed up, or why some will have worse back 9s because they got more tired and couldn’t repeat their compensations.

The way we swing doesn’t change from swing to swing. Those who whip the club inside get flat will typically get steep and over the top. They will have their normal ball flight for that shot then there will be their miss or big miss. The misses and big miss come from not being able to repeat the things they do to hit their normal shot. 
 

Many thing it’s their swing itself changes but it’s their ability to repeat whatever it is they do to hit their normal shot. Some also look at ball flight and start to change things to fix it from shot to shot and do it because Rey don’t understand what happened. Someone who usually has an open face or a path the causes a slice lines up slightly different or they rotate the face closed and now hit a hook will thing it’s the swing and to avoid that shot so they adjust something then end up with a totally different ball flight 

Here’s a couple swings from last year. Does this help? Again, I understand I need to work on my swing to launch more… but down to try any club tweaking or different clubs if there’s some hack 

MLM2 Pro with Range balls 

265 Carry

9 Launch 

84 feet apex 

163.4 Ball Speed 

1.45 Smash Factor 

112.4 club speed 
 

 

 

Swing 2

Carry 262

Launch 10.3

apex 84 

Club Speed 104.4

Ball Speed 156.4

Smash Factory 1.50

 

 

 

 

[walkerdb7]

12 hours ago, Micah T said:

@walkerdb7 what’s your tee height? I didn’t look at the most wanted thread, but if you’re hitting down, those numbers are pretty optimal. If you have an old driver, you could practice teeing it up higher until you get comfortable with it. You’ll never maximize your speed unless you at least get neutral with your AoA.  I don’t hit up much on my driver either, and use a 10.5 static loft driver. 

I think like 2 1/4 - 2 1/2”? I believe that is very tall?

[walkerdb7]

16 hours ago, cnosil said:

You might find this interesting. 

 

Watched the original and the follow up video, made my head spin, haha 

If I understand his point, we naturally set the club to neutral, so a closed face doesn’t exist in practice? So it’s just adding loft and making the club more upright?

 

 

[RickyBobby_PR]

6 hours ago, walkerdb7 said:

Here’s a couple swings from last year. Does this help? Again, I understand I need to work on my swing to launch more… but down to try any club tweaking or different clubs if there’s some hack 

MLM2 Pro with Range balls 

265 Carry

9 Launch 

84 feet apex 

163.4 Ball Speed 

1.45 Smash Factor 

112.4 club speed 
 

 

 

Swing 2

Carry 262

Launch 10.3

apex 84 

Club Speed 104.4

Ball Speed 156.4

Smash Factory 1.50

 

 

 

 

Kind of a swipey swing. I can see why you have a two way miss. Open face that when you end up rotating it to square or a little extra you get the left shot and when you don’t you get the ball that starts right and most of the time doesn’t come back left. Looks like you end up with a lot of shots though on the face and towards the toe. That will keep the spin down and when it gets to high on the toe the sub 2k spin.

Theres really not going to be any shaft or head that does anything magical here and it would come down to what feel you like.

The two way miss and the the push/push fade wine hard to stop with the long swing and how the pressure is shifting in your swing 

[walkerdb7]

2 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

 

Theres really not going to be any shaft or head that does anything magical here and it would come down to what feel you like.

The two way miss and the the push/push fade wine hard to stop with the long swing and how the pressure is shifting in your swing 

Thanks, that’s very helpful. As stated above, i assume it’s the carpenter and not the hammer. However, never want to discount some crazy idea or theory. 
 

shortening the swing, starting the downward rotation with my hips, and shifting the weight more properly are the 3 keys things I’m working on. 
 

I think you said it above, but when I play well, I’ve thought my timing or tempo was on. My instructor says I have mostly good pieces, they’re just in the wrong order, haha 

In the spirit of using whatever I’m happiest with then… do you think a 10K offers any help then? Like does that stability help me keep it more square or anything?

Edited March 16 by walkerdb7

[walkerdb7]

@RickyBobby_PR one other question

 

You stated above that because my swing has specific flaws, it doesn’t seem like there’s much to do with equipment in terms of delivering consistency. Went through some old emails, and found all of my fitting specs for the last 10 years.

I’ve literally been fit into category of club. Ap2, TM RSi, G400s, i210, and now T100S. I’ve also been fit into S400 shafts, S300 shafts, C tapers, dynamic gold light and then  switched to LA Golf. I’ve also been fit into 2° flat and 2° upright.

 

I’ve it’s the snapshot swing that day? Also, the fitter has a personal opinion on how to get the consistency I need?

The best change that we have made was weakening the loft of my current clubs by 2°. I get significantly better ball launch and did not lose distance.

Edited March 17 by walkerdb7

[RickyBobby_PR]

40 minutes ago, walkerdb7 said:

I’ve literally been fit into category of club. Ap2, TM RSi, G400s, i210, and now T100S. I’ve also been fit into S400 shafts, S300 shafts, C tapers, dynamic gold light and then  switched to LA Golf. I’ve also been fit into 2° flat and 2° upright.

So basically you’ve been fit to players distance or gi style irons. 
 

The iron shafts are all heavier shafts and designed to promote lower spin and launch(the amount is based on each individual swings) but we can look at tour players and see how high their hit their irons and know that it’s not super low launch or super low spin. The s300 and s400 are the same shaft and because the s400 is a little heavier than s300 it’s going to play a tad stiffer. I swap between these two shafts a lot 

 

52 minutes ago, walkerdb7 said:

I’ve it’s the snapshot swing that day? Also, the fitter has a personal opinion on how to get the consistency I need?

Yup it’s going to be a snapshot of your swing that day and having a day where you can’t hit a shot even close to what you do on the course is going to make it harder on the fitter to see exactly what your normal shot is. The better the fitter the more they can guess what’s going to happen on your better swing, especially if outdoors and they can see ball flight and if on grass divot patters and turf interaction.

Also correctly each fitter is going to have their personal opinion and process for how to address what the golfer needs or how to change things. The TM rep in my area used length to adjust contact point and ball flight over changing lie angle on irons based on the golfers swing and what the club was doing at impact. Sometimes he would use both.

The old Ping rep rarely used his monitor and was only there to show the golfer the change or lack of change despite a change in shaft or head. He used ball flight and golfers feedback on what to change. He fit my buddy to a driver that hasn’t left his bag since 2013. 
 

I’m not as sensitive to changes. I did a ping fitting for the g400 driver on back to back days with the second day being a better swing day and the choice made on day 1 with my not as good swing was the same as the choice on my better swinging day. I’ve been fit to the same shaft or shaft profile for the last 20 years despite lessons and my handicap dropping. I’ve also played random bling buy setups that have worked and a few that didn’t. In 2015 I played on back to back days on the same course with two different bag setups in iron shafts and my fairway wood. Day 1 I had my buddy’s 105g r flex shafts in Bridgestone heads and his Bridgestone 5w with the tour green r flex shaft.

day 2 I had the same irons but with my heavier and stiffer shafts in them and my Bridgestone 5w with a heavier and stiffer fujikura shaft. I shot the same score on both days

[walkerdb7]

1 hour ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

So basically you’ve been fit to players distance or gi style irons. 
 

The iron shafts are all heavier shafts and designed to promote lower spin and launch(the amount is based on each individual swings) but we can look at tour players and see how high their hit their irons and know that it’s not super low launch or super low spin. The s300 and s400 are the same shaft and because the s400 is a little heavier than s300 it’s going to play a tad stiffer. I swap between these two shafts a lot 

 

Yup it’s going to be a snapshot of your swing that day and having a day where you can’t hit a shot even close to what you do on the course is going to make it harder on the fitter to see exactly what your normal shot is. The better the fitter the more they can guess what’s going to happen on your better swing, especially if outdoors and they can see ball flight and if on grass divot patters and turf interaction.

Also correctly each fitter is going to have their personal opinion and process for how to address what the golfer needs or how to change things. The TM rep in my area used length to adjust contact point and ball flight over changing lie angle on irons based on the golfers swing and what the club was doing at impact. Sometimes he would use both.

The old Ping rep rarely used his monitor and was only there to show the golfer the change or lack of change despite a change in shaft or head. He used ball flight and golfers feedback on what to change. He fit my buddy to a driver that hasn’t left his bag since 2013. 
 

I’m not as sensitive to changes. I did a ping fitting for the g400 driver on back to back days with the second day being a better swing day and the choice made on day 1 with my not as good swing was the same as the choice on my better swinging day. I’ve been fit to the same shaft or shaft profile for the last 20 years despite lessons and my handicap dropping. I’ve also played random bling buy setups that have worked and a few that didn’t. In 2015 I played on back to back days on the same course with two different bag setups in iron shafts and my fairway wood. Day 1 I had my buddy’s 105g r flex shafts in Bridgestone heads and his Bridgestone 5w with the tour green r flex shaft.

day 2 I had the same irons but with my heavier and stiffer shafts in them and my Bridgestone 5w with a heavier and stiffer fujikura shaft. I shot the same score on both So if your summation that fitting is really only for better and more consistent players?

 

Or am I just a weird outlier and probably just start whatever I think looks or feels the best unless something drastically gets better? Or being with really consistent flaws?

 

unless something dramatically changes and I fix my swing, you feel like I could basically just play whatever I like to look and feel of?

 

re iron shafts: what I never understood before I specifically asked to try graphic shafts, is why I would get fit into a launch shaft if I have trouble getting the ball up? That’s where I’ve gotten lost in fitting. 
 

one guy think I’m flat, one upright, and everyone low launch… but I can’t get the ball up when I’m hitting poorly 

Edited March 17 by walkerdb7

[cnosil]

34 minutes ago, walkerdb7 said:

 

Or am I just a weird outlier and probably just start whatever I think looks or feels the best unless something drastically gets better? Or being with really consistent flaws?

 

unless something dramatically changes and I fix my swing, you feel like I could basically just play whatever I like to look and feel of?

 

re iron shafts: what I never understood before I specifically asked to try graphic shafts, is why I would get fit into a launch shaft if I have trouble getting the ball up? That’s where I’ve gotten lost in fitting. 
 

one guy think I’m flat, one upright, and everyone low launch… but I can’t get the ball up when I’m hitting poorly 

Not a weird outlier.  You have been fit to your swing to optimize launch conditions.  You would need to change your swing to get better results since you deloft and hit down with driver.    We can all play what we feel like playing but you may not hit the ball well.   If you got a 9* driver,  you would probably hit the ball shorter and get no height.

The high/low launch and high/low spin designations on shafts is a manufacturer label, is not a standard, and may not be  what you actually see when you hit the ball.   Shafts have a profile and that profile influences how you swing.   A low launch shaft from Manufacturer X may actually launch the ball higher than Manufacturer Y's high launch shaft.     Additionally a "high" launch shaft may only add a degree of two of launch compared to the "low" launch shaft.    

Fitters have their own way of achieving "ideal" conditions and as a result you will most likely see different results from different fitters.