2 part question - driver and shoes

[mbrodeur86]

Hey guys,

 

I recently re-tooled my golf bag - completely. Here's what I did:

 

Driver: Taylormade R1 Black to Nike Covert 2.0

Wood: Callaway Razr-X to Touredge exotics cb4 tour 

hybrid: Adams A12 OS to Ping I20

Irons: Taylormade burner 2.0 to Titleist AP2

Wedges: Cleveland CG16 to Mizuno MP-R12

Putter: Odyssey Versa to Odyssey Black Series #1

 

I did this because I felt I was stuck and could not get better. Since the change, I'm doing much better.

 

My dilemma is my driver. With the R1, I was very inconsistent. I could hit a hook off one tee and a fade/slice on the next one. When I hit it well, though I was carrying 250-260. Now, I do understand the temp change since I just got the Covert (mid-October) and have only played 2 times with it. I am/ was using the ProV1x which has been my ball of choice for maybe 6 years now but with the covert, I hit consistent fades to slices with it. I've closed the face, brought it up to 11.5 and down to 9.5 but still would like to hit it straighter. When I do connect it, I carry maybe 240-250. I've also tried changing my grip....

 

My question is this: Would this be because of ball spin? If I use a heavier ball like a bridgestone tour b330, it goes straighter, but not necessarily farther. I don't really like the feel of the ball either. My ball striking is pretty consistent to the middle of the club face with an occasional toe hit. Last week though, with the covert 2.0, I hit 9 fairways and 10 greens - never, ever did that before. So I love the accuracy of the driver - not happy about the fade/slice and distance....

 

Do I have the wrong driver? Should I have bought the Covert 2.0 Tour instead? Would that fix my problem. I am in zero position to try them out as the closest place to me would be a 5 hour drive....just can't make that happen at the moment.

 

Part 2

 

I recently sold my golf shoes and am in the market for new ones. I am a huge fan of the Oakley brand and am coming from Adidas Powerband 3.0 shoes. I was thinking of going with the Cipher 2's. I read the reviews here and overall, the guys seemed happy with them but I've read other reviews where they had problems with the nanospikes coming off and not sticking. What recommendations do any of you have? 

[hckymeyer]

The driver is a tough one, if I had to guess I'd say the shaft in the R1 was a better fit for you than the Nike.  That's the danger of buying blind, you really have no idea if it will be a good fit until you get a chance to try it out.  I also wouldn't concern yourself too much with the distance aspect.  Like you already mentioned with colder temps come shorter drives.  It's not an apples to apples comparison when there could be a 30-40 degree difference in temp between now and playing in june/july.  Personally I also tend to hit shorter due to having to wear a bunch of extra layers.  It's harder to swing freely when you have 2 or 3 layers on.

 

For the shoes I would start with the MGS shoe reviews.  It's a great place to get an idea of where you want to start.  Also on the Oakley's I know the first generation Cypher's did suffer from the nano spikes coming off.  I had heard they fixed the issue, but it was enough for me to take a pass on them.  My latest pair of shoes are Puma Biofusions and I absolutely love them.  Very light weight and in my opinion very stylish.  I picked them up on ebay for $65 while they are still selling for $170 at big box stores.

 

http://www.mygolfspy.com/most-wanted-best-golf-shoes-2014/

[revkev]

In regards to the driver have you hit it head to head with the R1? That way you would know which actually goes farther under the same conditions.

 

I wouldn't think the switch from a ProVIx to a B330 would make that much difference. They are similar ball types. The e series might provide less spin but you would loose some control around the greens and I know that I would be unwilling to make that sacrifice for a few yards and we have similar handicaps.

 

If you find that the Nike is shorter and fades more than you would like after the head to head test I would think it's the shaft also. It may be too light. I'd continue to bag the R1 and hang onto the Nike until you happen to be in a place where you can get for the proper shaft.

 

No comment on the shoes, I'm a Tru Links wear guy.

 

Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

[mbrodeur86]

Thanks for the reply guys. I can't go head to head since I sold the R1 to buy the Nike. I cannot afford anything new and there is no place to go to get fitted within an hour of where I am. I would not want to go to get fitted for something that I simply cannot buy and waste anybodies time. My swing speed is around 104-105 mph. I figure I should be carrying 250-260 depending on my launch.

 

I am thinking temp is the issue. It was close to 5-6 Celsius when we played while I played in 20-35 degree Celsius with the R1. I have a fast swing motion, would it help to slow it down a little? I find the tour b330 feels heavier to me. I've also played with the RZN Black (It sounds like a firecracker coming off the face) but it wasn't too bad either. I'd personally like to stick with the Prov1x.

 

My brother (who I always out-drive by 10 to sometimes 40 yards) uses a Callaway Warbird (a.k.a. rock made to look like a golf ball) and is now out-driving me. I have a hard time swallowing that lol

 

I'm really sold on the Oakley's. I've just always been  a fan of them but have checked out the Pumas. Actually, my running shoes are Pumas lol. 

[RoverRick]

If I use a heavier ball like a bridgestone tour b330, it goes straighter, but not necessarily farther. I don't really like the feel of the ball either.

 

Do I have the wrong driver?

 

Heavier ball?  The USGA limits the maximum weight and minimum size of the ball.  This is because of a smaller heavier ball goes farther.  Therefore, the main players will all get as close to these specs as possible.  So there is not really a weight difference in the balls.  The B330 may feel heavier to you off the club face simply because of the difference in compression.  I also do not really like the feel of the Bridgestone ball.  It is a shame.  I was part of the test for this ball, and am actually trying it again, but I loved the performance, but hated the feel around and on the green.

 

Sadly, it is probably the Indian not the arrow, or perhaps the bow, in this case.  I would try moving the ball back in my stance just a bit to get rid of the fade and slice with the Covert.  I think the difference here is shafts.  Perhaps even length.  TMag likes to but longer shafts and lighter heads on their clubs to create "more distance,"  The Nike Covert conversely came with a shorter shaft and a heavier head.  With the longer shaft it will bottom out slightly farther ahead than a shorter shaft, and by moving the ball back just a bit may solve that issue. 

 

As far as the difference in distance goes, Force=mass x acceleration.  In the case of the TMag, they have gone for increasing acceleration with a lighter weight and longer.  The Nike increases the mass.  This is variations on a theme.  Either one can work for you.

 

I too have the Nike Covert.  I have it set to neutral but I also found that when I set it to right it went left and set it to left it went right.  Personally, I think you need a bit of range time and a wrench before you trash the Nike.  That it what it took for me.

[Kenny B]

A 15-30 degree C temperature difference is huge. It's shirtsleeves vs jacket or multi-layers. When it gets to be late fall or early winter here in the NW, the ball doesn't fly as far and I'm not making as big a swing (it was never that big anyway, lol). Could be humidity too.

 

I tend to agree with RR on this. Spend some time with it; the feel may be part of it too.

 

BTW, I'm with Rev on the TruLinksWear guy.

[mbrodeur86]

Heavier ball?  The USGA limits the maximum weight and minimum size of the ball.  This is because of a smaller heavier ball goes farther.  Therefore, the main players will all get as close to these specs as possible.  So there is not really a weight difference in the balls.  The B330 may feel heavier to you off the club face simply because of the difference in compression.  I also do not really like the feel of the Bridgestone ball.  It is a shame.  I was part of the test for this ball, and am actually trying it again, but I loved the performance, but hated the feel around and on the green.

 

 

 

Yes, my apologies, this is what I meant. It definitely feels heavier. In my brother's case, he hasn't lost any distance with that rock of a ball. I, on the other hand.....

 

No way am I giving up on the Driver though. I do like it. I was just wondering if the Tour version of the driver would have been the better decision?

 

A 15-30 degree C temperature difference is huge. It's shirtsleeves vs jacket or multi-layers. When it gets to be late fall or early winter here in the NW, the ball doesn't fly as far and I'm not making as big a swing (it was never that big anyway, lol). Could be humidity too.

 

I tend to agree with RR on this. Spend some time with it; the feel may be part of it too.

 

BTW, I'm with Rev on the TruLinksWear guy.

 

Again, my brother hasn't loss any distance so is this in fact, the ball, the driver, the weather or the person swinging the club who would be the problem? lol

[BK in TEXAS]

You can pick up a couple shafts on ebay and try them out.  Resell the ones you don't like.  That's what I used to do when I lived a million miles from civilization.

[RoverRick]

I originally tried the Covert and loved it for most of a weekend and then did not.  So I did not buy it, but did write about it in A Covert Affair.  My wife did not see the humor in that story.  I did not keep it, but a month later or so I low balled the Covert Tour and am gaming it now.

 

Seriously though the whole right and left thing worked backwards for me so you may want to swap it hard the other way, or spend time on the range with ball position etc.

[mbrodeur86]

I originally tried the Covert and loved it for most of a weekend and then did not.  So I did not buy it, but did write about it in A Covert Affair.  My wife did not see the humor in that story.  I did not keep it, but a month later or so I low balled the Covert Tour and am gaming it now.

 

Seriously though the whole right and left thing worked backwards for me so you may want to swap it hard the other way, or spend time on the range with ball position etc.

 

 

Ok. So what do you find different between the two? If you are still using the tour, there must be something you liked?

[revkev]

The tour should decrease spin a bit. It's stock shaft is likely to be better and thus the higher price tag.

[RoverRick]

Ok. So what do you find different between the two? If you are still using the tour, there must be something you liked?

The Performance is 460cc with a wider face and the Tour is 430cc with a taller or deeper face which make the head seem even smaller.  I prefer the looks of the smaller head.  I put the 980F 13 and 17 back in the bag last week because I just love the looks of the smaller head.

 

Spin and shaft also seem to work for me.

[mnfats95]

Don't knock the fade if you can hit it every time. I myself will happily give up 10 or 15 yards to be in the fairway more. About the only time I'm not happy with it is into a stiff breeze. Other than that I can live with it as long as it's a 10 to 15 yard move and not a 20 or 30 yard one.

 

I bought some New Balance Minimus shoes this year on a whim. I have always worn their shoes for working out and general wear, so when I saw they had a lightweight show available I jumped.

 

I am not by any means a shoe maven, but they are the most comfortable golf shoes I've owned. When you walk on the grass with them you can feel the turf. The only downside is that they are not waterproof. They make some waterproof shoes, but I didn't care for the feel of the mid priced ones. Haven't had a chance to try the top of the line ones.

[mbrodeur86]

The Performance is 460cc with a wider face and the Tour is 430cc with a taller or deeper face which make the head seem even smaller.  I prefer the looks of the smaller head.  I put the 980F 13 and 17 back in the bag last week because I just love the looks of the smaller head.

 

Spin and shaft also seem to work for me.

 

 

Isn't the Covert 2.0 tour a 460cc head now? 

 

 

Don't knock the fade if you can hit it every time. I myself will happily give up 10 or 15 yards to be in the fairway more. About the only time I'm not happy with it is into a stiff breeze. Other than that I can live with it as long as it's a 10 to 15 yard move and not a 20 or 30 yard one.

 

I bought some New Balance Minimus shoes this year on a whim. I have always worn their shoes for working out and general wear, so when I saw they had a lightweight show available I jumped.

 

I am not by any means a shoe maven, but they are the most comfortable golf shoes I've owned. When you walk on the grass with them you can feel the turf. The only downside is that they are not waterproof. They make some waterproof shoes, but I didn't care for the feel of the mid priced ones. Haven't had a chance to try the top of the line ones.

 

 

I actually hit 9/14 fairways so I love the accuracy of it (even when I shot my personal best 74, I only hit 7 fairways with my R1). I just do not want to have to change golf balls because I love how the prov1x works around the greens and the feel of it. As for the shoes, I definitely need waterproof shoes since we have lots of water in my corner here. I ended up buying the Oakley Cipher 2's because of the price at oakleyvault ($49.99) and they are waterproof. 

 

I might actually try the shaft idea though. Was thinking of getting a tour head since if it offers a little less spin than the Performance head, it might be just what I need. If it's as accurate as the Performance head and spins less, sounds exactly what I need.

[RoverRick]

Isn't the Covert 2.0 tour a 460cc head now? 

 

Yes, the Covert 2.0 is a 460cc, but I have the Covert Tour 1.0.

[mbrodeur86]

oh, kk. I understand. Well, I'm going to hold on to this for a while for sure. I've JUST got it so I definitely want to give it a chance. I love the accuracy of it. I'm gonna try adjusting grip and ball position and a few other things way before I give up on it

[The Dansome]

OK so you and I share the same swing speed and other characteristics.

 

This year I have bounced between the SLDR and my original Covert Performance. After being fit for the SLDR in January I started a major swing overhaul and quickly fell out of love with the Tmag setup. The driver felt so hard to hit, but really that was a me thing as I was forcing all my swing changes upon it. So back to the Covert with a shaft change experiment to try and gain some yards (went from 9.5 to 8.5). Previously with the stock black shaft I couldn't get any major distance out of it, maybe 250 tops but the thing is stupid accurate. With the change to an Aerotech shaft I gained 10 yards and maintained the ridiculous accuracy of the Nike drivers. The Tour version I'm sure could add a few more yards with it's lower spin and setup but it will be nothing spectacular.

 

Fast forward to today, I've committed to my new swing and hence given the SLDR a second chance. Love it, damn bomber, seriously 20 more yards than the Covert. I'm going to say it now, the first generation Nike Coverts are not that long but you may want to experiment with some shafts. Don't get me wrong though depending on the length of course you play on average maybe just getting it in the fairway every time is a good thing. Long story short I don't think you're going to be able to force that much more out of your Covert.

 

Ball wise I found anything in the realm of an X version seemed to play a little better off the Covert.

 

http://forum.mygolfspy.com/topic/9899-sldr-vs-covert-taylormade-player-development-center/

http://forum.mygolfspy.com/topic/10104-sldr-vs-covert-revisited/

 

Shoes

 

I haven't tried the ones you're interested in so can't help you there, but I will tell you my experience with a few brands this year.

 

Adidas - has gotten narrower. I used to be able to buy an 8.5 wide without even trying them, now I can't find a size that's even comfortable in any model.

Trues - Really comfy, great for wide feet, sketchy durability. My first ever pair of Trues and the soles peeled off in 8 rounds and four of those were riding.

Ecco - Seriously stable fit and good for wide feet. Can't believe how stable they feel

Biion - The world's most comfortable golf shoe, I may never wear any of the above again.

[hckymeyer]

Biion - The world's most comfortable golf shoe, I may never wear any of the above again.

Unless it's cold or raining

[The Dansome]

Unless it's cold or raining

 

OK fine I won't wear them Nov - April... grumble, grumble, grumble...

[mbrodeur86]

LOL before I bought the R1, I went to a demo day (which is Christmas to me) and tried out drivers from Callaway, Ping, Titleist and then Taylormade (no Nike unfortunately wasn't there). The Ping G25 was my front runner until I got to the SLDR. I was hitting it consistently straight into the net at the 250 mark. The Tmag guy showed me the trackman data and it showed I was coming down onto the ball instead of up. He said if I could figure out a way to hit up on it, I'd add probably another 10 yards (Honestly been trying to fix this ever since by making sure my right shoulder is dipped throughout my swing)

 

So, me, not having any money but desperately wanting that SLDR, decided to Ebay an SLDR-S. I was fit for a 14 degree head and bought a 14 degree SLDR-S. Could not hit it to save my life! Everything was a slice to the right....EVERYTHING! 

 

So I sold it and bought the R1. But even with 11 degrees and 2 degree open, I was hitting hooks. Hook after hook. If I tried to fix my grip, slices and what not. Luckily, my iron play saved me many times.

 

My home course plays 6230. There's a nice mix of straight holes and some dog leg left and rights. I would like to get out of it as much as I can. I was hitting the R1 250-260 and I'm willing to sacrifice a little distance for the insane accuracy. I had it at 11.5 and started hitting them too high. So I brought it down to 10.5 and now 9.5 but I'm going to bring it back up to 10.5. Seemed better from there.

 

I'm looking at shaft options as we speak. Not really sure what I should be looking for in terms of torque and even weight or "tipped ends" and stuff.  Any recommendations?

[Kor.A.Door]

Good luck, even if you were to get fit, the Nike may not be the best for you. I too, would move the ball back just a bit to try to eliminate the slice, fades are good, you can play those all day.

The v1x is a really good ball, I think you can eliminate that variable as one of the problems, so it's either the club, or the guy swinging the club, with a HCP of 7.5, you are going to occasionally hit a bad one, but you are probably fairly consistent, so leaves the club. I switched from the R1, to the xhot2 pro version, we only have 6 holes that you can use driver, I went from hitting 2 or 3, to hitting 5 or even all 6 on most occasions, and when I do miss it's not by much, the difference is about 10-15 yards shorter, and about 10-15 yards straighter, giving up distance for accuracy is not a bad thing.

 

Shoes, that's all about how they feel on my foot, although i do like the adicross II, amd I also like the newer footjoy casuals

[mbrodeur86]

I've found that using the 4 more yards golf tees to have improved my ball striking considerably. With the black face of the R1, you could easily see where the ball left it's marked and other than the occasional hit outside the middle, most of them were.

 

I do like the Nike, really I do. I just haven't dialed it in yet. Like you said, I don't mind giving up, even 10 yards to keep it in the fairway. That's cool. I figure that with my R1, I should have been carrying 260-270 at optimal specs. If I can carry the Nike 250-260, I'd be a happy camper..