Getting fitted: do you want to *know*?

[GolfSpy MPR]

In a club fitting, would you rather the fitter explain his purpose behind each head/shaft/setting change, or would you rather not know what the fitter is doing (as much as possible) to avoid being influenced by what he's saying should happen?

My take: right now, I'd love a "blind" fitting with an expert fitter. To be sure, there are some changes that you can't not notice even as you're at address—you'll see the difference between a svelte blade and a chunky GI iron, for instance. And I definitely want him to explain at the end what I ended up with and why. But in the meantime, turn the screen off, let me swing without knowing the outcome, and put something in my hands that gives the best results.

[GolfSpy_APH]

Love this topic.

I am with you I would prefer more of the blind fit, however I will admit it is because I have not really had that. In many cases I have been the one dictating a lot due to the experience I have with fittings and equipment. 

Sign me up for a blind fitting and let the fitter find what is best for me. Would love to have this true experience and see what happens!

[GolfSpy TCB]

I think you described my take as well MPR.  

I actually want the fitter to LISTEN to my take on the different selections (my feedback) and use that along with what he sees with the results... and limit his comments to "ok... now try this one" (which could be a different head, or a different shaft or whatever.  Then once he has landed on the ULTIMATE CLUB for me... I want him to spend 6 hours explaining his process! HAHA.  Ok... maybe too much... but I want to understand his process to get to the end... but I would be thrilled to hear that information after the fitting is over, rather than during. 

 

 

[DSP210]

Just got fitted for a driver. didn't want to know the club or shaft combination that I was hitting at the time. But wanted the process explained at the end as to how I ended up with what I get. 

[GolfSpy MPR]

Yeah (replying to both fellow mods above), my concern at this point is that I think I know too much. I would love a completely open, brand-agnostic fitting. If a 40 gram ladies flex shaft gives me my best results, so be it. I would want to eliminate as much as possible my own preconceptions. And so for me (assuming an indoor fitting), I even want the screen off. I don't want to make my own adjustments. I'm just here to swing; the fitter is there to make the club the best possible tool for the swing I've got.

There was a day when I would have wanted a fitting in which the fitter explains every single step he's making to me. But at this point, I have too many of my own (half-baked) ideas.

(Obviously, my scenario here only works if the fitter is a wizard of golf equipment, which is also part of my dream scenario.)

[GolfSpy TCB]

3 minutes ago, GolfSpy MPR said:

Yeah (replying to both fellow mods above), my concern at this point is that I think I know too much. I would love a completely open, brand-agnostic fitting. If a 40 gram ladies flex shaft gives me my best results, so be it. I would want to eliminate as much as possible my own preconceptions. And so for me (assuming an indoor fitting), I even want the screen off. I don't want to make my own adjustments. I'm just here to swing; the fitter is there to make the club the best possible tool for the swing I've got.

There was a day when I would have wanted a fitting in which the fitter explains every single step he's making to me. But at this point, I have too many of my own (half-baked) ideas.

(Obviously, my scenario here only works if the fitter is a wizard of golf equipment, which is also part of my dream scenario.)

I LOVE Dream Scenarios!!  And this is a good one!!

[shailey]

I have a PhD in biomechanics so I want to know what is going on.  So, I like the why's and how's.  However, I think it should be a joint effort toward obtaining the players goals with their expertise.  So for me, that can only happen if I know why. 

The only true fitting I have had was exactly the opposite and it was actually at Club Champion.  He kept pushing to what he thought I needed due to my age, not paying attention to the metrics that were displaying on the screen such as apex height, fairway side tendency, spin rates, distance etc..  Finally, I left.  I have no need for a 218 yard 6 iron that is going 135 feet in the air.  They did email me back and said that I had valid points about my metrics and offered another free fitting and have other colleagues involved, but I never contacted them back.  

[RickyBobby_PR]

I always prefer to not not know when it’s handed to me what loft or what shaft including weight or flex.

However I do know why a change is being made because that’s part of the communication process with the fitter. The golfer has to be telling the fitter what he/she feels, sees, thinks. If not the fitter doesn’t know what changes to make. Yes he/she can see numbers and ball flight (assuming outdoors) but not what’s causing them. Is the feel to soft, to harsh, too heavy, too light. So based on the feedback one is going to know why the fitter is making a change. If it’s too soft then they are going to put in a stiffer feeling shaft. If its too light then changing shafts weight or if the driver has changeable weights out a heavier weight in.

I don’t care about the numbers because I don’t want to be chasing them, but I can watch the ball flight and see if there’s too much spin, not enough, if the ball is going to high, too low or just right. I will let the fitter know what I’m seeing and see if he/she sees the same, but it’s communicated in the information I mentioned above

[GolfSpy BOS]

Count me in the blind fitting group.  like @Golfspy_TCB I want to be able to offer my feedback but not necessarily know what the fitter is doing next.  At the end he can explain why we ended up where we are.  I'll disagree about the screen being off for me.  I still need to see the shot.  Ideally I'd be hitting outdoors.

When I was demoing the TSR line at PGASS there were a few shafts I didn't like the feel of just in my hand hovering it at address, but we still hit them a few times to see what happens during the swing.  It's amazing what a little bit of weight change or flex profile can do the feel, even static before you start to swing.

At the end of the day most of my recent fittings have all been "no significant performance gains" at least on the distance front, but sound and feel preferences can make a difference in confidence! 

[GolfSpy TCB]

41 minutes ago, shailey said:

I have no need for a 218 yard 6 iron that is going 135 feet in the air.

I think I have need for a 218 yard 6 iron... can you send it to me?  I'll pay shipping. 

[majduffer]

I like to know what the shaft will do to my ball flight.  

I also like to know what each setting on adjustable clubs will produce.  Of course I feel the most important part of fitting is the shaft type and flex. There is a reason if you go into a golf shop and look at their used clubs, they will predominantly be stiff flex shafts.  It is also very nice if your fitting is done on a range with launch monitor inorder to see what the  ball does on the ground.  I have a club fitter friend who messed up a $300 shaft so he put it in my TM 5w.  Wow, what a difference it made in how that club performed.  Of course a fitting will never surpass lessons with a good coach and lots of practice.  

[Middler]

While I admit I'm curious about every selection and tweak a fitter makes, I know it would slow down the process, and I am comfortable with letting the fitter steer the process without asking questions at every turn. That said, I just got a D-3W-3H fitting last Fall and I was not satisfied with what the first Titleist staff fitter came up with - it made no sense to me, or most here evidently. I sent a text to that fitter, and he told me he meant a different D shaft weight, which doesn't even exist. Huh?

So I got fit again, and the second Titleist staff fitter chose different shafts and weights for me, and put me in D-4W-7W. I have been very pleased with the new sticks. Both had all the same shafts to choose from.

Kinda makes you wonder...

I did a Club Champion driver fitting about a year earlier, and if I had asked him to explain each change, it would have taken all day with all the heads and shafts he threw at me. That fitting was a total waste of time and money - that fitter was incompetant.

[Siamese Moose]

Every time I've seen a fitter, I've asked upfront to keep it as blind as is practical. I know a fair bit about clubs, but I'm no expert. If he tells me he's changing X, my overactive brain will think, "That should cause this change", and I won't be able to stop myself from making swing changes based on expectations. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[rkj427]

8 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

I always prefer to not not know when it’s handed to me what loft or what shaft including weight or flex.

However I do know why a change is being made because that’s part of the communication process with the fitter. The golfer has to be telling the fitter what he/she feels, sees, thinks. If not the fitter doesn’t know what changes to make. Yes he/she can see numbers and ball flight (assuming outdoors) but not what’s causing them. Is the feel to soft, to harsh, too heavy, too light. So based on the feedback one is going to know why the fitter is making a change. If it’s too soft then they are going to put in a stiffer feeling shaft. If its too light then changing shafts weight or if the driver has changeable weights out a heavier weight in.

I don’t care about the numbers because I don’t want to be chasing them, but I can watch the ball flight and see if there’s too much spin, not enough, if the ball is going to high, too low or just right. I will let the fitter know what I’m seeing and see if he/she sees the same, but it’s communicated in the information I mentioned above

 

This perfectly describes the process I had when I was fit for both driver, fairways, and irons a few years back. Spent about 2 1/2 hours total time over a couple sessions before finding the right for me set-ups.

And then when it all said was done, went back one last time to make sure that the results/feelings, etc. were what I wanted or expected from the choices we made at that time.

 

[GolfSpy_APH]

Going in soon for an iron fit (I hope) it is a unplanned drop in so we will see. However I am going to ask for it to more blind fitting and see what comes out!

[Fjd]

I definitely want to know what the fitter is doing and especially why.  There were comments about slowing down the process if you questioned the fitter.  This may be a benefit since the one of the problems during the fitting process is getting tired due to the number of balls you hit.  As a long time golfer, I want to know why certain things are happening as we change shaft flexes, shaft weights, or changes in spin and trajectory with head changes.  Good to know since we now have clubs that are adjustable and I may want to know what affect I will have on ball flight if later I make an adjustment change to my club.  

[cnosil]

When doing a fitting I am going to let the fitter do their job.  I understand it isn’t an exact science and a different fitter will come up with different recommendation; maybe drastically different, will approach the fitting differently, and  will have their personal equipment preferences based on past successes and failures.  Prior to the  the fitting I will try to provide as much input  as I can to explain my goals and if I have some specific things I don’t want to include in the fitting (I personally don’t have any biases against any component).   During the fitting I’ll just provide feedback on what my experience is with what was handed to me.  
 

Because I want understanding; after the fitting I will ask what we ended up with, what he was trying to accomplish,  and why we ended up where we did.  I’d ask questions about some of the things we tried and didn’t try.  If cost becomes a problem, maybe some reasonable alternatives,   

[Golf2Much]

I'm with most of you on not initially knowing what is going on.   By knowing what the fitter selected and why upfront might create a little swing bias.  If I thought the shaft was too stiff or not stiff enough, I might unconsciously modify my swing to match.  By not knowing, I can give honest feedback on what I feel, and it frees me to swing normally.   In the end, let the results speak for themselves.  

However, once we've settled on the right combination, I would want to know why and all the details I could get.  Not only to better understand my swing and what club parameters that optimized the performance, but to make me comfortable that the fitter knew what they were doing!

[StrikurJim]

  I have to be honest.  I am an over thinker.  Tell me nothing put the club in my hands and let me hit away.  Give me the numbers/results every 10/15 balls.  Don’t even tell me the brand/model.  Feed me the data and top three when the session is over.  I will tell the fitter from the start what I would like and what I am using, but that’s it.  Just give me the best options for me.

Edited February 10, 2023 by StrikurJim

[Bbowers]

As a fairly new player I want more information. I like telling what my goals are and I want to understand the reasons they are picking a product or change. I don’t want to dictate a brand though. It helps me develop a relationship with the fitter as I think it’s not a one and done process.

[capifico22]

I've had enough fittings to know that if I don't take an active role, the outcome will be subpar.  If I went to TXG HQ, I'd probably let Jesus take the wheel a bit more.

[MIGregB]

When I read MPR's opening thread, my 1st thought was, "Heck yes! I want it blind until it's over!" But then after reading comments from shalliey (although he's in a different class all by himself with his biomechanics expertise) and others, I realized I couldn't hit shots as blindly as having the screen turned off because I need to see the ball flight to know whether I'm even in the ballpark with my swing. I used to have a net set up in my basement for winter use and discovered that the swing that felt so sweet with, what I was certain was, excellent ball contact was in reality ingraining a nasty pull hook. So, I need to at least see ball flight even if I'm in the dark about what the immediate change is that the fitter is making. 

SO, what does this boil down to? Just like EVERYTHING else in golf, there isn't one thing (club, ball, swing, thought...) that's right for everyone. Hopefully one can find a fitter that can work effectively with the process that works best for you. Finding that fitter; well, that's a different story.

[Zman56]

I definitely want to know why they are changing each item.  The more knowledge the better.

[joedeausen]

19 hours ago, shailey said:

I have a PhD in biomechanics so I want to know what is going on.  So, I like the why's and how's.  However, I think it should be a joint effort toward obtaining the players goals with their expertise.  So for me, that can only happen if I know why. 

The only true fitting I have had was exactly the opposite and it was actually at Club Champion.  He kept pushing to what he thought I needed due to my age, not paying attention to the metrics that were displaying on the screen such as apex height, fairway side tendency, spin rates, distance etc..  Finally, I left.  I have no need for a 218 yard 6 iron that is going 135 feet in the air.  They did email me back and said that I had valid points about my metrics and offered another free fitting and have other colleagues involved, but I never contacted them back.  

It's not necessarily about the company that's doing the fitting.  The club fitter's experience level and ability to communicate is what makes for a good fitting.  Just like taking a golf lesson.  The Pro giving the lesson needs to assess your skills, tools, and give you the right knowledge/information in each lesson.

[GPS111]

I want to know the outcome but not everything and every change during the fitting.  Give me a starting combination then let what it feels like and performs drive the tweaks until I have the combination that performs for me.  I'll want to know what I end up with as far as specs and numbers but don't want to know during the fitting.  All they'll do is add more to the swing thoughts.  I'll tend to try and compensate for what I know about that combination than swing with the fundamentals to get what I need.

[Frickenhacker]

As a fitter I like to explain as much as I possibly can. People get get stuck on manufacturers, lofts, flexes, grip sizes etc.   So I think info helps them to understand my equipment suggestions. I also think that the more they understand  about their gear the more confidant they become and the better they will improve and play.   Some are so stuck that it's a total waste of energy but still have to make the attempt right?

Edited February 10, 2023 by Frickenhacker

[Bstubby11]

20 hours ago, GolfSpy MPR said:

Yeah (replying to both fellow mods above), my concern at this point is that I think I know too much. I would love a completely open, brand-agnostic fitting. If a 40 gram ladies flex shaft gives me my best results, so be it. I would want to eliminate as much as possible my own preconceptions. And so for me (assuming an indoor fitting), I even want the screen off. I don't want to make my own adjustments. I'm just here to swing; the fitter is there to make the club the best possible tool for the swing I've got.

There was a day when I would have wanted a fitting in which the fitter explains every single step he's making to me. But at this point, I have too many of my own (half-baked) ideas.

(Obviously, my scenario here only works if the fitter is a wizard of golf equipment, which is also part of my dream scenario.)

When I got my fitting last Spring, one of my major points was I wanted to see my real ball flight.  I went to Miles of Golf where they have an outdoor heated range so I could see the ball flight off the club and they also had a Trackman to get all the data.  It was a great experience.

[JackBurtonsPorkchopExpress]

When I finally get fitted for something I want all the info. All the data. To me this helps me understand the "why" behind what the fitter is doing and takes any doubt out of my head when hitting the clubs. Otherwise I'd feel like I'm giving my money to a random stock broker and just trusting they have my best interest in mind.

[Franc38]

56 minutes ago, capifico22 said:

I've had enough fittings to know that if I don't take an active role, the outcome will be subpar.  If I went to TXG HQ, I'd probably let Jesus take the wheel a bit more.

I'm with you, I need to talk, tell the fitter what I want, what I see usually, what I feel when trying stuff.

What you do on a given day, in a fitting bay, hitting on a screen or a range, may or may not have any relation whatsoever with what happens when you play golf on a course with co-competitors, on a random day. Telling the fitter what you do see most often, what you enjoy or hate and explaining.
And since you never hit a club without a preconception on what you'll do and what it'll do for that, I feel letting the guy pass you clubs without explaining what it is would induce just as much bias as telling you what it is and what it should do. It's a catch-22 of sorts.

Now, I've never tried a "slient/blind" fitting and it might be wonderful. Except that I've pretty much tried 80% of the clubs released in the last 6 or 7 years and know what I like and what I don't like, plus I know my specs in general, and unless I do change drastically my swing that's unlikely to change much (so my last iron set, the Takomo, was bought sight unseen and I'm very happy with it, thanks very much).

 

 

EDIT. I've also stopped dreaming, after having tried all these clubs, of a specific thing that would "help" me massively. Or hinder my game massively. I've done the experiment and there's more difference in my scores from day to day than there is from using this or that equipment. What equipment does is remove questions and make you feel better, safer, "one with the ball flight".... be the ball!

Edited February 10, 2023 by Franc38

[billybogey]

Yes; do wish "End of Fitting" Summary explained & a Take Away Summary/Guide in print to read & what to work on during Season.

In "Plain" language so that I can understand. K.I.S.S. does apply here!! I am a little Slow!!