Are You Methodical? What Are You Thinking?

[chisag]

... I have often wondered about those that are "methodical" what are they thinking? I watch players and have no idea what could take so long before actually hitting their shots. I am not talking about slow play which has nothing to do with my question. Good players too but really any player I get paired up with that seem to take a long time looking at their shot before execution and other than some kind of self talk they learned from a sports psychologist, I have no idea what could be going through their minds. 

As an example this is my best case scenario after looking through my rangefinder and seeing 161yds:

160 is a stock 7 iron. Done ... 5 seconds max

And that's it for me. I pull a 7 iron, envision my trajectory, line up my shot and swing.

worst case scenario after looking through my rangefinder and seeing 161:

160 is a stock 7 iron
7 mph wind into me so 6 iron hit normal and a little long is OK
deep bunker short and 6 iron carries that
10 feet left is my best option. Done ... 15 seconds max

 I pull a 6 iron envision my trajectory, line up my shot and swing.

... I just don't know what else I could be thinking but I see players take 2 to 3 minutes surveying and going through their pre shot routine and then hitting the shot. So if you are a methodical player, what is going through your head that would take longer than 20 seconds before hitting your shot? Again, this has nothing to do with pace of play or any other kind of judgement. I am just genuinely curious as to what players that takes longer than 20 seconds are thinking. 
 

[bens197]

I’m not sure some people could break their mental habits. Think about the most black & white rule follower who is incredibly rigid and abides by consequences. 
 

I don’t have the ability to understand how a Brian Harman can maintain focus after waggling longer than a 13 year old refusing to wake up for school. 
 

Even if the evidence would support better results, I believe some people just cannot adjust their behavior. 

[Kenny B]

28 minutes ago, chisag said:

I am just genuinely curious as to what players that takes longer than 20 seconds are thinking. 

I try to envision a similar shot where I hit the ball well... sometimes I can't think of one.  

[chisag]

10 minutes ago, bens197 said:

I’m not sure some people could break their mental habits. Think about the most black & white rule follower who is incredibly rigid and abides by consequences. 
 

I don’t have the ability to understand how a Brian Harman can maintain focus after waggling longer than a 13 year old refusing to wake up for school. 
 

Even if the evidence would support better results, I believe some people just cannot adjust their behavior. 

 

... LOL, I get that. But what IS their mental thought process. What are they thinking that takes so long? I watch Pro's looks at a putt from every angle then crouch and stare at it for what seems like forever. I can only surmise it is something their sports psychologist told them to do"I am worthy. I am a great putter. I will make this putt. Clear your mind and just think of the ball going in the whole. Take a deep breath. Make it happen" Kinda thing. 

[GolfSpy_SHARK]

I am no help here. I think the max I really debate a shot is if winds in play or a drastic up or downhill shot. Don’t typically take long especially when I’m walking and am able to see where my ball is in relation to the hole.

Do you think methodical minds wonder why we are so quick to hit a shot ?

[sirchunksalot]

Me: "Don't shank it, don't shank it, don't shank it". 

In all honesty, I think the reason I'm over the ball a bit too long is I'm trying to get comfortable over the shot and sometimes I have way too many swing thoughts going on in my head. 

1. Try to get a feel for not opening the face on the backswing. 

2. Am I lined up right?

3. Turn, don't sway.

4. Where should I focus? 

5. Commit to the shot. 

6. Relax.

I have way too many demons after a couple of years of bad play. It's getting better, but I still have a way to go. 

 

 

[chisag]

29 minutes ago, Lacassem said:

Do you think methodical minds wonder why we are so quick to hit a shot ?

 

... We have a rotating group of 6 golfers playing Mon-Fri and the only female is by far the fastest. One started a pre shot routine this season and he is a little slower than the rest of us, but certainly not slow. Tuesdays and Thursdays can be only 2 of us so we get paired up with others. We once had a very methodical guy that may or may not have shot under 100 and told me at the end of the round when I shot -2 for the day "I think you would be a better player if you didn't rush through your shots. You guys all play way too fast". 

... We had a perfect day last week playing behind the last of the Phoenix Qualifier. They started on the back and 3 players quit after 9, shooting well over qualifying so there was only one Pro in front of us with his caddies and he was gone by the 2nd hole. It was 78* with no wind, bright sun and with nobody in front of us and nobody behind us after the first hole, we played in 3:50. We enjoyed each others company and conversations as well as playing golf. We all found it interesting playing at our own pace and never rushing we played in just under 4 hours.  

... Fwiw, we all walk and we never use the cart girl. I called her over just after Christmas and said "I know I never buy anything from you..." and she interrupted "I know! I was shocked when you waived me over" and I continued " I bring my own reverse osmosis water from home in a steel bottle so don't wanna use plastic and only eat organic snacks but I am glad you are here and I might need you one day. So Merry Christmas" and gave her a $20. I always felt bad about never ordering from her. 

[Josh Parker]

If I take any time on a shot, there is something in the way or I'm having to make a certain shot shape to get there. I still don't think it ever takes several minutes to make my shot. 

[Rob Person]

Not to confuse a methodical thinker with a critical thinker. 

Methodical has to have every part of their routine in order. Any misstep in that process forces them to start over.

A critical thinker has their shot ready in their mind, but may find something that throws their calculations off ( ie, fairway slope, unseen cart path, heavy wind change, or a crossover water hazard., etc) and need to take an extra minute to recalculate. 

 

[Wheelieb]

I pick a point and aim at it. Then I question myself quite a bit. So I look at the point then back to my original spot the club face is pointed. When I see this I feel I’m way off, so I adjust then hit. Which almost always throws everything off. So not really of any help. 

[DiscipleofPenick]

@chisag I agree with you, I don't get it.

I use the think box/play box idea and stick to a routine. 20 seconds is more than enough time to figure out the shot and clear the mind. 

Shoot the target with the rangefinder, pull a club, one practice swing, get my line, set up and fire.

[cnosil]

Prior to a tee shot, approach,or wedge shot there are slightly diFferent thoughts.

generally I try to hit a stock shot so there isn’t much thought about ball flight, but I look for a target area based on distance from the hole and hazards which takes into account the wind.   I’ll add in some assessment of lie for approach and wedge shots, and wedge shots gets additional focus on landing spot.  
 

this is all pretty quick and is started when other people hit I would guess that I  hit my shot in about 30 seconds

[cksurfdude]

Another example: very good and very long time friend - who "should" quote unquote be a better golfer than me as he started before I did, he's more athletic and coordinated than I am (we did some HS gymnastics together), more flexible, etc. - but he stands for what seems like a full minute in his setup appearing frozen over the ball...

.. and then doesn't hit the shot he wanted and gets mad at himself...

I love the guy and would like to golf more with him but between that and the phone (he runs his own business) it's hard to...

I've tried to quiz him on his methodology but he doesn't have a clear answer, just sorta "..working on what my pro gave me"

(Yes we've had multiple discussions about practicing on the range vs playing the game on the course.)

 

Anyway...

19 minutes ago, DiscipleofPenick said:

I use the think box/play box idea and stick to a routine. 20 seconds is more than enough time to figure out the shot and clear the mind. 

Yes, even as an improving (let's call it) player I try to do the same - e.g. think about strategy and shot type and club selection and swing effort for the estimated distance and effects of environmental conditions and what my pro told me and my swing thought of the day and did I have enough for breakfast and which beer am I gonna have at the 19th and wow that chick was hot very nice (fill in the blank) and etc etc etc way before I even get to my ball.

Then just a few seconds to... step up .. settle in .. go.

(.. followed by a brief internal grumbling and cursing which yes we're working on this year vis á vis improving the self talk and the mental game!)

 

Also...

16 hours ago, Kenny B said:

I try to envision a similar shot where I hit the ball well... sometimes I can't think of one.

Hilarious! But seriously on the flip side -- better golfers simply have more experience on the course and thus more "shot knowledge" in their mental golf database .. so yeah in many cases they've "seen" the shot at hand previously and know what to do.

We, umm, improving golfers are still calculating the odds and weighing the pros and cons of...

• Shot A = something only a Tour pro should do on a come from behind gamble it all to force a tie breaker on Sunday afternoon

vs

• Shot B = ok here's what playing smart golf says I should do

[Kenny B]

7 minutes ago, cksurfdude said:

We, umm, improving golfers are still calculating the odds and weighing the pros and cons of...

• Shot A = something only a Tour pro should do on a come from behind gamble it all to force a tie breaker on Sunday afternoon

vs

• Shot B = ok here's what playing smart golf says I should do

I wasn't thinking about a shot that could be considered difficult.  I was thinking about a short, normal, straight, shot from a flat lie in the fairway to a large green with no hazards around.  There are times when I haven't hit that shot in awhile, and... well, I'm old so my memory doesn't go vary far back to when I had a good shot.  

[Shrek74]

I think Rob Person has a good thought about this.
Critical Thinker vs Methodical Thinker.

Methodical is just that - there is a mental checklist that HAS to be followed in order every shot. If the order gets messed with, they HAVE to start over. Having a pre-shot routine is one thing, but this golfer HAS to fellow their process, like a horrible OCD.

Critical is very different. They think through their shot, good/bad miss locations, green firmness and rollout, penalty areas, wind, etc. all run through their thought process. But their not frozen in fear if they don’t follow a step by step method. They think through the shot, grab a club, and go.

Just my $0.02 on the differences. I need to add more critical thinking into my game.


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