Club Details Please

[fixyurdivot]

I was watching the Women's US Open last night and kept wondering which exact club some were using on certain shots.  Because so many amateurs play distances closer to the LPGA players than PGA players, it is fun to compare their selection to what we might choose to use for a given shot. Some broadcasts are pretty good at either stating what club a player is using - in some cases displaying it.  That got me to thinking how cool it would be if we viewers had all the details about a players bag and shot by shot club selection.  We get bits and pieces of some players "what's in the bag" but why not the full Monty?  Do you think doing so somehow reveals competitive secret/advantage?

[Middler]

You can probably find much of that info? https://www.golfwrx.com/642708/hinako-shibuno-witb/

[fixyurdivot]

29 minutes ago, Middler said:

You can probably find much of that info? https://www.golfwrx.com/642708/hinako-shibuno-witb/

Thanks.  I've never used the WRX website and the WITB feature though I've seen it via other sources. I wonder if this is a player by player decision as to providing specific details or via background research/digging by others?  I was just thinking it would be nice to see that info, more consistently, as part of the live play. I'm somewhat on the fence as to whether it gives away any competitive advantage.  Undoubtedly players and their caddies are watching - particularly in adverse play conditions. 

[RickyBobby_PR]

1 hour ago, fixyurdivot said:

Thanks.  I've never used the WRX website and the WITB feature though I've seen it via other sources. I wonder if this is a player by player decision as to providing specific details or via background research/digging by others?  I was just thinking it would be nice to see that info, more consistently, as part of the live play. I'm somewhat on the fence as to whether it gives away any competitive advantage.  Undoubtedly players and their caddies are watching - particularly in adverse play conditions. 

Wrx has people at tournaments but they also use Darrel survey from what I can tell. Jonathan wall does a lot of WITB for pga tour wins and I believe he primarily uses Darrel survey for his info when he’s not on site.

one thing to keep in mind is that players may uses different club and swing length for the same distance based on environmental variables, pin location, lie, potential trouble

[fixyurdivot]

2 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Wrx has people at tournaments but they also use Darrel survey from what I can tell. Jonathan wall does a lot of WITB for pga tour wins and I believe he primarily uses Darrel survey for his info when he’s not on site.

one thing to keep in mind is that players may uses different club and swing length for the same distance based on environmental variables, pin location, lie, potential trouble

Interesting.  I've not heard about either of those sources.  For sure on the subtleties you point.  I just always find it fun to know which club their hitting.   

[cnosil]

4 hours ago, fixyurdivot said:

Interesting.  I've not heard about either of those sources.  For sure on the subtleties you point.  I just always find it fun to know which club their hitting.   

Darrel survey is the industry standard.  They are on the first tee the first day of  every tournament and document every club in the players bag.  That doesn't mean that players don't switch the next day.  I don't think knowing the clubs provides any type of competitive advantage,  but the manufacturers probably don't want it released especially of a player has a logo for one manufacturer but plays something else. 

[GaDawg]

6 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Wrx has people at tournaments but they also use Darrel survey from what I can tell. Jonathan wall does a lot of WITB for pga tour wins and I believe he primarily uses Darrel survey for his info when he’s not on site.

one thing to keep in mind is that players may uses different club and swing length for the same distance based on environmental variables, pin location, lie, potential trouble

Just be careful what you post on their forum. They love kicking people off!

[RickyBobby_PR]

58 minutes ago, GaDawg said:

Just be careful what you post on their forum. They love kicking people off!

Been posting over there for about 4 years now with no issues

[fixyurdivot]

4 hours ago, cnosil said:

Darrel survey is the industry standard.  They are on the first tee the first day of  every tournament and document every club in the players bag.

Yet another thing I did not know.  So I presume that bag check is just to know what they started the round with; no more than 14 clubs and which ones?  I wouldn't think they are checking for conformance to USGA limits.

[cnosil]

Yet another thing I did not know.  So I presume that bag check is just to know what they started the round with; no more than 14 clubs and which ones?  I wouldn't think they are checking for conformance to USGA limits.

They don’t count the clubs or check for conformance. They are a company that was simply hired to capture what clubs a player is playing with. They have a binder with every players previously used clubs and update as needed. Simply an inventory.

As far as I know we mortals cannot get access to the site but pretty sure it is how we get those stats that X club or shaft was the most used at the tournament.

You can read more about them here: http://darrellsurvey.com

[fixyurdivot]

36 minutes ago, cnosil said:

They don’t count the clubs or check for conformance. They are a company that was simply hired to capture what clubs a player is playing with. They have a binder with every players previously used clubs and update as needed. Simply an inventory.

As far as I know we mortals cannot get access to the site but pretty sure it is how we get those stats that X club or shaft was the most used at the tournament.

You can read more about them here: http://darrellsurvey.com

Just read their history/bio.  It's interesting how things like this get started. Did Eddie and Virginia Darrel wake up one morning and say "dang I'd sure like to know what's in their bags" ?   I've been playing and watching this game for over 50 years and never heard of them.  

[Tom the Golf Nut]

10 hours ago, fixyurdivot said:

Yet another thing I did not know.  So I presume that bag check is just to know what they started the round with; no more than 14 clubs and which ones?  I wouldn't think they are checking for conformance to USGA limits.

Probably not counting the clubs. Seen to many times penalties coming into play with one two many clubs in the bag. Usually an extra driver when deciding between two from range work and forgetting to pull the one they are not going to use. I believe there were one or two caddies that lost their job over not making sure there were only 14 clubs in the bag.

[Middler]

On 12/13/2020 at 1:59 PM, fixyurdivot said:

Interesting.  I've not heard about either of those sources.  For sure on the subtleties you point.  I just always find it fun to know which club their hitting.   

You probably realize the brand and model may have been heavily modified for each touring professional using any given club. From time to time you even hear rumors suggesting some players clubs are entirely custom made (Tiger at times in his career), bearing little resemblance to what's stamped on the club. I don't expect that kind of information would ever be included in a live broadcast, and it wouldn't mean much anyway. e.g. If an announcer says "Brooks used his JPX919 Tour 7 iron on that shot" - that does not mean it's anything like a JPX919 Tour 7i any of us could buy off the rack or even from a fitter.

[revkev]

You probably realize the brand and model may have been heavily modified for each touring professional using any given club. From time to time you even hear rumors suggesting some players clubs are entirely custom made (Tiger at times in his career), bearing little resemblance to what's stamped on the club. I don't expect that kind of information would ever be included in a live broadcast, and it wouldn't mean much anyway. e.g. If an announcer says "Brooks used his JPX919 Tour 7 iron on that shot" - that does not mean it's anything like a JPX919 Tour 7i any of us could buy off the rack or even from a fitter.

Nor would I want to - I have no business hitting a club that would fit Brooks. The reality is that off the rack would come much closer to fitting me than what he uses.


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[Middler]

13 hours ago, revkev said:

Nor would I want to - I have no business hitting a club that would fit Brooks. The reality is that off the rack would come much closer to fitting me than what he uses.
 

We’re in agreement. The OP wants to know the “exact club” a given pro is using for a shot. My point simply, was knowing what brand/model a given pro is playing, doesn’t correlate to what’s in stores, so having that reported won’t mean anything. IOW you can’t buy Justin Thomas’ Titleist driver at any store even though it’s a “TS3.” His shafts, lofts, lies, swingweights, etc. are tailored to him and undisclosed, they’re not on any store rack. Some pros play outright custom clubs despite their markings.

[revkev]

We’re in agreement. The OP wants to know the “exact club” a given pro is using for a shot. My point simply, was knowing what brand/model a given pro is playing, doesn’t correlate to what’s in stores, so having that reported won’t mean anything. IOW you can’t buy Justin Thomas’ Titleist driver at any store even though it’s a “TS3.” His shafts, lofts, lies, swingweights, etc. are tailored to him and undisclosed, they’re not on any store rack. Some pros play outright custom clubs despite their markings.

Absolutely - fully agree - I suppose anyone could customize theirs to be like his for a price. We also know that some players have the ball that they use customized as well - hence a dozen or so iterations of the Pro VI on the confirming list.

I think it’s less the case with the women - as the OP stated their swing speeds are much closer to ours. Since OEMs make their equipment to perform best for the majority of people the clubs used by LPGA players are much closer to stock. They are also far more likely to have oldie hoodies in their bags.


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[cnosil]

2 hours ago, revkev said:

Absolutely - fully agree - I suppose anyone could customize theirs to be like his for a price. We also know that some players have the ball that they use customized as well - hence a dozen or so iterations of the Pro VI on the confirming list.

I think it’s less the case with the women - as the OP stated their swing speeds are much closer to ours. Since OEMs make their equipment to perform best for the majority of people the clubs used by LPGA players are much closer to stock. They are also far more likely to have oldie hoodies in their bags.

 

I would also guess that the vast majority of PGA players don't have "custom" clubs and are playing stock heads.   those clubs may have been hand picked for characteristics to deal with tolerances.   The top players in the world that are faces for a brand are probably the most likely to have more of a one off type club.