I know sound and feel is intensely personal so maybe it's me...

[Beakbryce]

It struck me in the last few days that either I lack any feel and sound discrimination, or the hot new clubs just don't appeal to me. If you have read any of my posts about drivers, the realization that I love my years old Epic driver is well, epic. I just went through the Mizuno long game review process and the driver left me cold. I wasn't into the sound which I felt was not memorable and couldn't feel where the ball hit on the clubface. I passed them on to test to @Silver Fawkes and while he just got them, he already appears to love the sound and possibly the feel. You might want to follow his review as he tries out the driver, 3 wood, and 4 hybrid as it already looks like he is going to be a strong reviewer.

Anyway, back to this discussion. When the Stealth first came out I hit one at a demo day and wasn't impressed. I had a chance over Christmas to hit the Ping 430 driver and the Paradym X driver. Both clubs are highly rated for my swing speed. I wasn't enthusiastic about the sound or feel of any of these clubs. This is pretty weird as I have always liked Callaway woods and have felt in the last several years that Ping is building nice woods. I was really hoping in particular the Paradym X would blow my socks off because I have started looking for a reasonable price on Callaway pre-owned and am now rethinking that notion.

I'm hoping I can blame the lack of sound to my years being around jets and guns, but feel? Really trying to find an excuse.

Please let me know if you have started to discern less feel and sound from the new generation drivers or it's just me! I hate to see a grown man cry, but I can take it. 

[cnosil]

10 minutes ago, Beakbryce said:

Please let me know if you have started to discern less feel and sound from the new generation drivers or it's just me! I hate to see a grown man cry, but I can take it. 

As a most wanted tester,  I get to hit all the drivers that MGS tests.  What I have noticed is that the sound on drivers is becoming more muted.  There is obviously a correlation between sound and feel and while I can tell where I hit the ball on the clubface there is only a subtle change in sound/feel.   I think you may be on to your issue with the guns/jets.    I am guessing you like the higher pitched/metallic sound off a driver?

[Beakbryce]

54 minutes ago, cnosil said:

As a most wanted tester,  I get to hit all the drivers that MGS tests.  What I have noticed is that the sound on drivers is becoming more muted.  There is obviously a correlation between sound and feel and while I can tell where I hit the ball on the clubface there is only a subtle change in sound/feel.   I think you may be on to your issue with the guns/jets.    I am guessing you like the higher pitched/metallic sound off a driver?

I like a rifle shot sound so you may be on to something there. I hate the dull thud. I play with lots of people with different drivers and most times I couldn't tell you how the other drivers sound, it's just not memorable. I wonder if the companies have focus groups that listen to driver sounds and vote for the one they would like to play. Would be interesting to "hear" those results.

You are right in that with the metallic sound it may be easier to figure out where it hit on the club head as it gets tinnier enhancing "feel". If it is a dull thud all over it just doesn't work.

I also wonder if this is a swing speed issue. Want a larger bell sound, hit the bell harder! Gosh I hope that isn't true because I am at that age where the swing speeds begin to decline. 

[Silver Fawkes]

I eluded to this in my review (which I did the hybrid comparison by the way and will post today or tomorrow), but sound is a massive factor to me. There are two things that determines how a club "feels" to me: the way the shaft bends during my swing and the sound the club head makes when it strikes the ball.

I prefer metallic overtones in my woods and hybrids, but it's tricky. The pitch can't be too high or the club feels harsh. If the pitch is too low it feels dead. If it has no metallic overtones at all it's completely lifeless to me. 

Sound is how I can tell where I hit it on the face. It does take time to get to know a club that way, but that's how I can tell. I mean if I shank it or hit it way out of the toe I can physically feel that through the club, but more subtle off center strikes are communicated through sound.

I certainly don't think this applies to everyone and I could be totally alone in this, but I think sound is so important in our perception of club performance. 

[Preeway]

It would take a lot for me to buy a driver/club that didn’t sound or feel “right”. Like, I would choose the driver that averaged 5 yards less if it felt better or sounded better. I really like the Ping 430, it sounds better than the 425, but I still won’t consider it even though it had the best dispersion out of the 4 drivers I tested.  

[cnosil]

2 hours ago, Beakbryce said:

I also wonder if this is a swing speed issue. Want a larger bell sound, hit the bell harder! Gosh I hope that isn't true because I am at that age where the swing speeds begin to decline. 

Not a speed issue,  just the way OEMs are making clubs sound like.  

[chisag]

3 hours ago, Beakbryce said:

You are right in that with the metallic sound it may be easier to figure out where it hit on the club head as it gets tinnier enhancing "feel". If it is a dull thud all over it just doesn't work.

 

... I do think many of us that grew up hitting persimmon woods and balata balls love that "dull thud" and why I love my Stealth2 HD that sounds/feels exactly like that on center contact. But miss it a little high/low or heel/toe and it certainly sounds/feels different. Not a night and day difference for sure but a slightly higher pitched thud and it just feels "hard" instead of that feeling of the ball melting into the face. Obviously this is pretty subjective so you may "feel" differently. 

[CFreddie]

We could always just go back to this driver

But seriously, it’s def a subjective thing, and one I’ve just grown accustomed too as driver tech continues to advance.

 

[russtopherb]

As I noted in my Mizuno review, the sound of that driver made me think that it was much shorter than my MAVRIK Max. It just sounded and felt weaker, so imagine my surprise when I used them back to back for a round and discovered that the Mizuno was actually longer (and straighter). Sometimes there are going to be trade offs depending on your own personal preferences. I'm gladly taking the extra distance over the "better sound". 

I also played the Knuth High Heat for a while, and let me tell you, I've never had anyone approach me from another fairway to ask me what driver I was using because the sound was so piercing he could hear it from where he was!

[GolfSpy_APH]

The other factor is the sound inside vs outside. I am pretty sure it was the Rogue but I made one hit with it and that was it put it away and never once thought about hitting it again. While the Ping G425 was a really good driver the sound was big and offputting. Even though performance was solid it made it much easier to move onto the Paradym that has a very muted sound. 

[IndyBonzo]

This is interesting to me that sound impacts feel for so many.  That has not been my experience.  While sound has never been a big factor for me with driver, I have enjoyed very much the muted sound of the Paradym TD, while also finding that it has the best feel of any driver I have hit - I always know where I struck the ball on the face (perhaps bc I hit the center too rarely, but anyway).

Query how much the shaft impacts sound too, if at all?   This is purely anecdotal, but in my last round with a new shaft I thought my driver sounded even more muted than usual. This had no impact on feel for me at all.  And to be clear, I am not saying others are wrong, it’s just interesting the different importance folks place on different things.  

[Rob Person]

Driver and woods off the tee I can definitely tell a difference in sound. That Burner 2.o I had was just awful sounding off the box. My 3Hy was also bad sounding off the box.  In the fairway the ground muted alot of that. I am playing a TopFlite Driver now and its a huge difference.  Its between that thud, thwack, and ting sound. I may not hit it further,  but the feel and sound is solid to me. 

I'm sure as I progress in my game, I will find other equipment will fall into that sound and feel faults. I do notice it too through the ball testing I've done.

[RickyBobby_PR]

21 minutes ago, IndyBonzo said:

That has not been my experience.

Same for me. Two different things to me. Some drivers you can tell where on the face it makes contact with the ball. Some get louder on the low heel or high toe compared to a center strike. Some I haven’t noticed a difference in sound between good and bad hits.

Feel for me is the feedback I get in my hands and arms from off center hits and how it’s different compared to center strikes. 
 

Until the stealth line I was a fan of TM heads and their sound. I think Ping has done a great job fixing sounds since the g30 and before days. My favorite sounding driver was the Bridgestone j715 

[WFWP91]

The golf trend is more carbon in driver/fairway/hybrid heads plus more hollow body irons with hybrid-like performance. I liken this technology transition: persimmon woods/driver to stainless steel woods/drivers and the transition from stainless steel to titanium. Sound has changed with technology, and it seems most golfers have adapted their preferences due to the performance gains each throughout the years.

[GolfSpy BOS]

13 hours ago, CFreddie said:

We could always just go back to this driver

But seriously, it’s def a subjective thing, and one I’ve just grown accustomed too as driver tech continues to advance.

 

I came here to post the Cleveland Hi-bore XLS... but this will do! haha

 

@Beakbryce it seems you're in the minority of golfers who like that loud sound from the driver.  I know Mark Crossfield has talked about this before too and he's mentioned that some of the people he's fitted don't like that a lot of drivers are sounding more muted, while others love it.  

Also, I've found the ball can make a significant difference in sound.  are you using a softer ball?  Might be able to switch into something firmer to get a little more of a crack sound of the driver! 

 

 

[GolfSpy_KFT]

@Beakbryce if you're looking for a louder sound with driver, the Aerojet line from Cobra this year was certainly more "explosive" sounding than what I am used to with my TSi3, but it is not a bad sound at all. I know some others noted this in their review during the Cobra challenge. The feel is good as well for me, you can tell when you miss one vs when you flush one. Prices on those have already come down and will continue to do so when the Darkspeed line is released, so if you haven't hit one of those I would give it a go and see if it suits your ear. It isn't harsh by any means but it is certainly on the louder side for me. I believe @chisag had similar thoughts with it, too.

[GolfSpy_KFT]

Ignore the less than stellar swing , but you can hear the AJ Max sound in this video.

 

[Beakbryce]

15 hours ago, chisag said:

 

... I do think many of us that grew up hitting persimmon woods and balata balls love that "dull thud" and why I love my Stealth2 HD that sounds/feels exactly like that on center contact. But miss it a little high/low or heel/toe and it certainly sounds/feels different. Not a night and day difference for sure but a slightly higher pitched thud and it just feels "hard" instead of that feeling of the ball melting into the face. Obviously this is pretty subjective so you may "feel" differently. 

I started with wood woods. Maybe the sound is what drew me to the original GBB when it first came out. What a revelation sound wise. I still have that club, maybe I will take it out in the next few weeks. Probably won't be as impressed.

[Josh Parker]

I don't know that I have a sound preference, as long as I am hitting the ball well with it, I could care less.  I will say that looks have played a part in me initially liking a club but it has to perform.

[Beakbryce]

2 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Feel for me is the feedback I get in my hands and arms from off center hits and how it’s different compared to center strikes. 

I agree. If it can't be felt in the hands, I am not into the club. 

[Beakbryce]

2 hours ago, GolfSpy BOS said:

@Beakbryce it seems you're in the minority of golfers who like that loud sound from the driver.  I know Mark Crossfield has talked about this before too and he's mentioned that some of the people he's fitted don't like that a lot of drivers are sounding more muted, while others love it.  

Also, I've found the ball can make a significant difference in sound.  are you using a softer ball?  Might be able to switch into something firmer to get a little more of a crack sound of the driver! 

Mostly Titliest Pro V's and Vice pro plus. MGS has shown that higher compression balls work better for every ball speed and I concur with that as I hit a lot of different balls. We find a lot of balls on our course and I have tried them all. Interestingly, I found a Pinnacle Soft the other day and hit it. I kind of thought it was an oxymoron as Pinnacles are rocks. I hit it because I had just read that it would pass the new ball test proposed by the USGA. It went nowhere. I only hit it once so didn't think about the sound. 

[Beakbryce]

1 hour ago, Jnoble89 said:

@Beakbryce if you're looking for a louder sound with driver, the Aerojet line from Cobra this year was certainly more "explosive" sounding than what I am used to with my TSi3, but it is not a bad sound at all. I know some others noted this in their review during the Cobra challenge. The feel is good as well for me, you can tell when you miss one vs when you flush one. Prices on those have already come down and will continue to do so when the Darkspeed line is released, so if you haven't hit one of those I would give it a go and see if it suits your ear. It isn't harsh by any means but it is certainly on the louder side for me. I believe @chisag had similar thoughts with it, too.

Thank you for the info. I am not actually looking for a new driver. My Epic is fine. However, if I can feel it in my hands I would try it, so it is on my list.

I had just noted that the sound of the newer drivers was muted thud. From the discussion, it looks like a majority of golfers prefer that so probably why the manufacturers are going that way. I like to feel the hit in my hands so sound isn't as big a factor for me. If the driver was 15-20 yards longer, I wouldn't really care how it sounds...

Maybe that's the secret the manufacturers have found in their testing. Everyone can live with a muted thud if the driver outperforms significantly what they have, but if it is too loud, they lose a significant portion of buyers who just won't purchase a loud driver.

I have always waited several generations between drivers. They all advertise longer, but my perception is they aren't all that much longer over the last few years, but they are definitely getting straighter. Maybe that's a topic for another day.

 

[Fred Mitchell]

1 hour ago, Josh Parker said:

I don't know that I have a sound preference, as long as I am hitting the ball well with it, I could care less.  I will say that looks have played a part in me initially liking a club but it has to perform.

Give us a driver that goes down the middle and 10 extra yard an sounds like honking a clowns nose, WE DONT CARE 

[lyndonbud]

18 hours ago, Preeway said:

It would take a lot for me to buy a driver/club that didn’t sound or feel “right”. Like, I would choose the driver that averaged 5 yards less if it felt better or sounded better. I really like the Ping 430, it sounds better than the 425, but I still won’t consider it even though it had the best dispersion out of the 4 drivers I tested.  

I can definitely agree with this, the sound of ping drivers has totally thrown me off with those clubs and i could never see myself playing a driver from them. likewise i’m not a fan of their irons and feels so the only thing i could play from them is their putters/ possibly wedges.

[RickyBobby_PR]

1 hour ago, Fred Mitchell said:

Give us a driver that goes down the middle and 10 extra yard an sounds like honking a clowns nose, WE DONT CARE 

Not me. I couldn’t stand the sound of the ping g series drivers that were out in the 2013-2016. Despite how good they were i couldn’t game them. The g400 was the perfect shift for Ping to a good sounding driver that performed well

[Fred Mitchell]

9 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Not me. I couldn’t stand the sound of the ping g series drivers that were out in the 2013-2016. Despite how good they were i couldn’t game them. The g400 was the perfect shift for Ping to a good sounding driver that performed well

With u at a 7 handicap I get it to a point but when i see people who cant break double bogey going on on on about looks, feel and sound of this club and that club while wearing their 5 hundred dollar outfit and looking down thier nose at a guy they got "stuck" in a foursome with whos playing a well used set of off the rack Wilson clubs. Yet he is literally wearing their ass out on the golf course but being patient while they play hide and go seek for their 7th lost ball. I just want to treat ol Biff like a puppy and grab him by the scruff of the neck and rub his nose in a box of X outs. 

[Josh Parker]

1 hour ago, Fred Mitchell said:

Give us a driver that goes down the middle and 10 extra yard an sounds like honking a clowns nose, WE DONT CARE 

Absolutely! Haha

[chisag]

29 minutes ago, Fred Mitchell said:

With u at a 7 handicap I get it to a point but when i see people who cant break double bogey going on on on about looks, feel and sound of this club and that club while wearing their 5 hundred dollar outfit and looking down thier nose at a guy they got "stuck" in a foursome with whos playing a well used set of off the rack Wilson clubs. Yet he is literally wearing their ass out on the golf course but being patient while they play hide and go seek for their 7th lost ball. I just want to treat ol Biff like a puppy and grab him by the scruff of the neck and rub his nose in a box of X outs. 

 

... LOL, there are degrees of madness for sure. I have always said I envy those left brained individuals that can play a club based on performance with no care whatsoever about the look or sound/feel. I am not talking about the fashion golfer that doesn't like the colors or shape of logos on the sole or back of a club they can't see when playing, just those that prefer a certain look in the address position. I have gotten compliments on how sharp my Stealth2 HD head looks with my Ventus Red shaft and I have to say "it's purely coincidental" and when the Qi10 Max comes out and I end up switching to that but head, my Red will not look so sharp. Thankfully my ball and scorecard couldn't care less if my head and shaft make a fashion statement.  

... That said my clubs have to at least look and sound in the right ballpark for me to play them. If I am demoing two new drivers and one feels/sounds/looks a little more pleasing but the other produces better trajectory, spin and distance but doesn't sound/feel or look quite as good I can certainly play that club. But if the head shape is off putting or the sound/feel too off the mark I know I will get rid of it after the first bad round. I can play a wedge that isn't the teardrop shape I prefer or has a slightly thicker top line than I like if it performs better than what I am playing but my leniency doesn't go this far:



  

[Fred Mitchell]

6 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... LOL, there are degrees of madness for sure. I have always said I envy those left brained individuals that can play a club based on performance with no care whatsoever about the look or sound/feel. I am not talking about the fashion golfer that doesn't like the colors or shape of logos on the sole or back of a club they can't see when playing, just those that prefer a certain look in the address position. I have gotten compliments on how sharp my Stealth2 HD head looks with my Ventus Red shaft and I have to say "it's purely coincidental" and when the Qi10 Max comes out and I end up switching to that but head, my Red will not look so sharp. Thankfully my ball and scorecard couldn't care less if my head and shaft make a fashion statement.  

... That said my clubs have to at least look and sound in the right ballpark for me to play them. If I am demoing two new drivers and one feels/sounds/looks a little more pleasing but the other produces better trajectory, spin and distance but doesn't sound/feel or look quite as good I can certainly play that club. But if the head shape is off putting or the sound/feel too off the mark I know I will get rid of it after the first bad round. I can play a wedge that isn't the teardrop shape I prefer or has a slightly thicker top line than I like if it performs better than what I am playing but my leniency doesn't go this far:



  

I agree there are limits but my exaggerated example of Biff isnt that far of an exaggeration to some I have seen. My biggest peeve is sound. A better player feel has validity and looks can have some play into mental side. But sound the freaking ball is gone, if you are really really good MAYBE but if you are NOT good and trying to get better watch where the ball goes and quit listening to the club.  No disrespect to you or anyone elses opinion just expressing mine, if 99 people think I am a peckerhead for saying it and 1 person who really really needs help with his game needs to quit listening to very good players talk about looks/feel/sound/etc and concentrate on results sees this and doubles down on results then call me MR PECKERHEAD.

[BigBoiGolf]

23 hours ago, Beakbryce said:

It struck me in the last few days that either I lack any feel and sound discrimination, or the hot new clubs just don't appeal to me. If you have read any of my posts about drivers, the realization that I love my years old Epic driver is well, epic. I just went through the Mizuno long game review process and the driver left me cold. I wasn't into the sound which I felt was not memorable and couldn't feel where the ball hit on the clubface. I passed them on to test to @Silver Fawkes and while he just got them, he already appears to love the sound and possibly the feel. You might want to follow his review as he tries out the driver, 3 wood, and 4 hybrid as it already looks like he is going to be a strong reviewer.

Anyway, back to this discussion. When the Stealth first came out I hit one at a demo day and wasn't impressed. I had a chance over Christmas to hit the Ping 430 driver and the Paradym X driver. Both clubs are highly rated for my swing speed. I wasn't enthusiastic about the sound or feel of any of these clubs. This is pretty weird as I have always liked Callaway woods and have felt in the last several years that Ping is building nice woods. I was really hoping in particular the Paradym X would blow my socks off because I have started looking for a reasonable price on Callaway pre-owned and am now rethinking that notion.

I'm hoping I can blame the lack of sound to my years being around jets and guns, but feel? Really trying to find an excuse.

Please let me know if you have started to discern less feel and sound from the new generation drivers or it's just me! I hate to see a grown man cry, but I can take it. 

Most drivers these days have an, ahem, gel-like hot melt inaccurately/haphazardly inserted into them to achieve weight. If you cut a driver head in half or have had the pleasant experience of having a crown pop off, you can see this magical work.

Inserting any material or changing the materials of the crown/body will affect acoustic performance, as well as changing the supporting and flex rigidity of the face. It's a reason why all-titanium crowns sound very "bright".

As for feel, can't really say much on that, I've been playing the same driver shaft for ages, only thing I really noticed when testing different heads were the sound, they all still feel like aluminum baseball bats.