2023 Titleist White Box Testing Thread

[JohnSmalls]

Interesting to see the cover scuffing from wedges.  Seems like the cover is tearing up a little more quickly than I would expect based on your posts.  Wonder if this new test ball has a reformulated cover?  Or if it made on the same line as the Tour Speed.  IIRC  Tour Speed covers scuffed up a little more quickly than the cast urethane covers of Pro V/AVX lines.

[BKervin]

Just finished up 18 holes with the Titleist Test balls.  Played half the holes against Callaway ERC Soft and Saintnine Misty (my usual ball) the second half with Srixon Soft Feel and Saintnine U-Pro.  (I have used all of these along with Callaway Supersoft or Callway Chrome Soft.  I only had used balls of the Callaways so I didn't test against them.  I get balls from my daughter as birthday/Christmas presents so I've tried a variety.)

The Titleist had similar trajectory as the other 4 balls.  It did not travel the same distance as the other balls and came up shorter.  It is a firmer ball than the "soft" balls I normally use.  The sound of the Titleist is much more solid sounding when hit with driver, woods or irons.  It travel very straight - I usually have a slight slice but I didn't with the Titleist.  

On the green, again the ball was much more solid and not as Soft as the other balls.  I needed to give a little more stroke to get the Titleist to travel a similar distance as the other balls.

My perspective on the Titleist is - it seems to be more for someone with a faster swing than I have.  My husband uses ProV1 and the Titleist Test seems to favor the same type of play as when I've used his ProV1.

 

Edited November 7, 2023 by BKervin

[Peejer]

My Titleist “TEST”. Balls showed up yesterday!  Taking them out for a spin on Friday and running the numbers on the simulator or Saturday.  I decided to wait on the sim stats so I don’t have any preconceived ideas about what to expect.

I’m reallylooking forward to the results!!

— Peejer

[snoopy79]

On 11/6/2023 at 2:15 PM, Tom the Golf Nut said:

Did some digging around my closet of balls. The dimple pattern looked to be similar to the TaylorMade TP5x but then found a new sleeve of Titleist AVX and as far as I can see the AVX and the TEST ball have the same pattern.

I hit into the sim screen with a 9 iron and the ball feels like the AVX and Pro V1 do. The AVX, ProV1, and the Test ball feel similar off of the putter face as well. So the ball is not in the firm “X” category. 

If I get a chance tonight I’ll try to get some data off the MEVO. Leaving for business tomorrow morning for the rest of the week.

Totally agree on the dimples. That was the first thing I noticed. I think this test ball is much softer than either ProV1 or V1x and its even a little softer than a TP5. I don't have any AVX balls but i did find a NXT Tour S and the covers feel very simliar. That being said the numbers will tell the tale in the simulators.

 

The on-course feel is TBD as well as I am not sure when I will get out again.

Edited November 7, 2023 by snoopy79
Pics

[TJ Hall]

I will be mainly focused on green side control with these, have been through Maxfli and Kirkland balls this year and didn’t feel like they spun enough around the green.  Will be going out later this week hitting a variety of shots.Have the Test Subject, Pro V1x, Vice Pro (current gamer), AVX and Tour X…will be interesting to see how they compare.

Based on looks alone, agree with most that it seems to be close to the AVX.

And, just because I love my Vokeys…

[jj1010]

First off I want to say thank you for allowing me to test as this is my time being chosen. After finding out I was chosen a couple weeks ago, I finally got the email late last week notifying me they were finally shipped and due to arrive Monday. Well after a shipping mishap (thanks FedEx) these bad boys finally arrived this morning! I went scavenging through my bag to see what balls I could find to compare the looks and weight of these to. I usually game the TaylorMade TP5x PIX ball or Callaway ERC Soft, so I compared these to those two along with a couple of different generation ProV1s and a ProV1X. As it's mention in previous post these appear to compare closest to the AVX but sadly I couldn't find any of those to compare them to. Of the ones that I have the test balls were closest to TP5X dimple wise.  I'm going to see if I can get a hold of some AVX to see if what everyone is saying is true. 

For testing it will sadly have to be all inside as living in Minnesota has its disadvantages and with the temps dropping almost all the courses are closed for the year, so it will have to be just feel testing of putting in my basement and then hopefully I can get to a simulator at some point to get some concrete numbers. If we get a heat wave possibly some short game work in the back yard!

[Josh Parker]

I played another 9 with my regular playing partner and finally lost one of the test balls on hole 26 for the day.  I wish I would have gotten a photo of the ball prior to that but had planned to at the end of the round.  

Honestly it was going to go in the bucket for putting and chipping at the house because it was all scared up and was looking pretty rough.  The durability is a little bit on the lacking side for me and I wouldn't say it's even close to how the kirklands were for me but I kind of expected a little more.

[Smf4505]

Who's gonna cut one in half?

[TJ Hall]

2 minutes ago, Smf4505 said:

Who's gonna cut one in half?

Already done by @ZoonORama

[taylorjonasher]

I've been waiting for the last few days MF'ing the FedEx guy every time he stops at the neighbors house and lustfully poring through the photos that everyone has been posting. The mailbox has been checked several times a day (just in case there was an overnight delivery), and finally my wife asked me what I was so antsy about.

"Remember those Titleist balls I told you about?" I asked.

She replied "You mean the ones that have been sitting inside the front door for two days?"

Long story short, I owe my FedEx guy an apology and after about 30 swings these balls are a little bit softer than my current ProV1's.

I'm going out for 18 on Saturday morning and plan to hit the chipping range, putting green, and R10 between now and then to compare them side by side with the ProV1's.

A big "Thank you" to Titleist and MGS for the opportunity to evaluate these balls! This is so awesome!

[2puttbogey]

Looks like I’m going to be late to the party. FedEx has them coming on the 13th for me. The joys of living in Hawaii! At least I’ll have some of the best weather for the testing.

[azstu324]

Got mine in today. Won't have a chance to put them in action until next week unfortunately. 

I've set 1 aside for some pretty hefty sim action. I plan to beat the hell out of it along with my other 2 regular game balls. My objective is to put them all through their paces to collect dry ball stats and test the durability of all 3. I know the Maxfli Tour very well. I play the Tour X during the summer when it's warm and the Tour S when things cool down during the winter. I've really gotten some great performance and durability out of both models so the Titleist "?" Ball has it's work cut out. 

Being that these are blank test balls, I took the liberties of renaming them left /right .. which also happens to be my initials "S.M." in Morse code

Let the testing begin! 

[taylorjonasher]

17 minutes ago, 2puttbogey said:

Looks like I’m going to be late to the party. FedEx has them coming on the 13th for me. The joys of living in Hawaii! At least I’ll have some of the best weather for the testing.

I'll trade you some upper 40's and wind.... Deal?

[rkj427]

FedEx delivered the Titleist Test Balls today but delayed my Titleist iron arrival until tomorrow for some unknown reason. 

Have rounds scheduled for Friday, Saturday and Sunday as it will be dry but also only mid 40's for high temperatures.

Saw the prior posts relating the dimple pattern to the AVX, but it also is similar to the pattern also used on the Tour Speed models as well.

Will update after playing them and will also use them indoors on my putting mat prior to playing to get some feel for how they will be off the putter face.

Typically, I play Maxfli Tours or Pro V1's, so I can compare them to those models as well.

 

 

[Javs]

You can find my full review:

 

[NickyBobby]

Love to see it 

[Javs]

11 minutes ago, NickyBobby said:

Love to see it 

Page 4 of this thread

 

[Tincuptim]

Dimples look different! Very interesting. 

[SpanishHands]

I am sorry friends, but the wait is killing me. I am not in Africa as @Leonvdwesthuizen but I guess that shipments to Spain will also take some time. Fortunately, weather is not an issue and everything is ready, from weekend rounds lined up whenever the balls show up, to some indoow launch monitor testing to be done at home.

In the meantime, I am open to suggestions on the appropriate testing procedure. I wil lay out the initial plans and happy to receive comments/suggestions

1) Set up the Mevo + and hit some irons at home (unfortunately, I cannot hit drivers in the garage). Use 4 balls: Test, ProV1x, AVX and Z-Star XV and 5 shots per iron (5i, 8i, 54ºwedge). Total 60 shots. Focus on distance/spin/trajectory

2) Take it to the putting green. Compare it to one of the other balls. Focus on feel

3) Practice chipping with all 4 balls and focus on feel, spin and feel

4) Take it out on the course and play 2 balls (side by side, same shots). 

The AVX yellow balls I have are from 2021, I believe (I found an incredible offer back then, and I do not loose many balls). Which ball should I do the side-by-side comparison? Apparently these are new AVX, so it could be interesting testing them with older AVX to see evolution. Or perhaps try the ProV1x and find differences.

Suggestions?

 

[GolfSpy_APH]

1 hour ago, SpanishHands said:

I am sorry friends, but the wait is killing me. I am not in Africa as @Leonvdwesthuizen but I guess that shipments to Spain will also take some time. Fortunately, weather is not an issue and everything is ready, from weekend rounds lined up whenever the balls show up, to some indoow launch monitor testing to be done at home.

In the meantime, I am open to suggestions on the appropriate testing procedure. I wil lay out the initial plans and happy to receive comments/suggestions

1) Set up the Mevo + and hit some irons at home (unfortunately, I cannot hit drivers in the garage). Use 4 balls: Test, ProV1x, AVX and Z-Star XV and 5 shots per iron (5i, 8i, 54ºwedge). Total 60 shots. Focus on distance/spin/trajectory

2) Take it to the putting green. Compare it to one of the other balls. Focus on feel

3) Practice chipping with all 4 balls and focus on feel, spin and feel

4) Take it out on the course and play 2 balls (side by side, same shots). 

The AVX yellow balls I have are from 2021, I believe (I found an incredible offer back then, and I do not loose many balls). Which ball should I do the side-by-side comparison? Apparently these are new AVX, so it could be interesting testing them with older AVX to see evolution. Or perhaps try the ProV1x and find differences.

Suggestions?

 

Same boat here in Switzerland. From my previous experience with testing and timing for when EU stuff arrives it is generally two weeks after. So I would say at least another 10 days.

[SpanishHands]

Thanks for this. I will relax for a while and aim at an end of November testing. 

Knowing I will not have the balls in my hands for a while, the engineer and fluid mechanics professor in me could not help but dig a little bit deeper in the impact that the dimple patter may have in our golf balls. Buckle up for a somehow dense and longish post.

This may get a little technical, but feel free to ignore it if your head hurts. It will not improve your game. Maybe just satisfy some nerdy curiosity. I will try to make it educational. Please forgive the teacher in me if you already know all this. 

I will write it in a separate post for further clarity. 

 

 

 

[ArizonaLogan]

Full review inbound, but so far I think they're slightly "softer" than other "tour" golf balls. They feel about the same same as "non-tour" urethane balls like the Triad and AVX.

[Contron]

Mine arrived at the perfect time!

I just finished up the last touches for the golf sim and I’ve got 18 lined up for Saturday!
 

The plan is to compare it to my gamer, Callaway Chrome Soft LS and also to a previous ball I tested, Oncore Elixr. With those 3 balls I intend to collect sim data with a wedge, a 7 iron and Driver. Then hit the links this weekend and collect real life feels and frustrations. Being in Kansas I’m definitely curious to see how it plays with some gnarly winds.

[ZoonORama]

13 hours ago, Smf4505 said:

Who's gonna cut one in half?

Done that….

[SpanishHands]

Knowing I will not have the balls in my hands for a while, the engineer and fluid mechanics professor in me could not help but dig a little bit deeper in the impact that the dimple patter may have in our golf balls. Buckle up for a somehow dense and longish post.

This may get a little technical, but feel free to ignore it if your head hurts. It may not improve your game. Maybe just satisfy some nerdy curiosity. I will try to make it educational. Please forgive the teacher in me if you already know all this. 

 

AERODYNAMICS, DIMPLES AND GOLF BALL PERFORMANCE

Basics

Dimples in a golf ball help the ball get more distance.

They are an aerodynamic design improvement. A smooth golf ball will carry a significantly shorter distance to a dimpled golf ball. This was discovered experimentally with the first rubber balls (gutta perchas) and is now a key feature of any golf ball design. 

If you want to learn more about this (it is quite complicated) you need to search for boundary layer separation in spheres. To try to explain it in a few lines, any object moving through the air creates a low pressure wake behind it. This is why cyclists and cars can go faster if they follow closely another cyclist/car in front of them. This low pressure wake, creates a resistance (drag force) to advance and therefore reduces the total carry distance. The dimples, reduce the "boundary layer separation", and therefore the size of the wake, and the total resistance the golf ball experiences.

This is a figure from my class notes that I hope helps you visusualize it (labels are in Spanish). I made the figure, that is why I am posting it.

Drag, Lift and lateral forces

However, the golf ball does not only experience drag. It also experiences a second force of a vertical nature, the lift force. 

All asymmetric objects moving through the air will usually experience both forces, lift and drag. The origin and nature of the forces is dictated by the geometry of the object. 

Positive lift is a vertical force that allows airplanes to fly and may create problems in very fast sport cars (that can be mitigated with the addition of wings). 

In the case of the golf ball, the origin of lift however lies in spin. The same way that a baseball, a football (soccer) or a tennis ball will present curve trajectories as they spin, so does the golf ball. The origin of this forces is physically explained by a principle called the Magnus Effect. 

(source: Rdurkacz - Wikipedia)

This is behind a curve ball in baseball, a topspin shot in tennis or Messi bending a free kick shot. 

In golf, we know that spin numbers are very high. And therefore the forces are very relevant. Spin has two effects on golf balls:

1) Lift: Spin will create a vertical force on the ball. A golf ball always presents backspin or underspin (as anyone with a launch monitor will know). As a consequence, golf balls present a vertical upward force (lift) that is similar to the one experimented by planes. This is helpful as it increases carry compared to a ball with no lift. 

The greater the spin numbers, the greater the lift. Too much spin and the ball "balloons" and has a less penetrating trajectory. If the spin is too low, the trajectory will be too low.

2) Lateral force: The golf ball does not spin around a perfect horizontal axis. Although it can only spin around 1 axis, if this axis is not perfectly parallel to the ground, a second lateral force will appear. Depending on the direction of the rotation, the ball flight will be a draw or a fade. We know that the face to path angle determines this spin axis.

Consequences:

A higher spinning ball will fly higher and take greater lateral effects (draw or fade more)

As we know, the secret of modern golf balls is to be able to reduce spin numbers with the driver (so the trajectory is optimal) while increasing spin with shorter irons for stopping power in the greens.

Air temperature, humidity and density

All aerodynamic forces (drag, lift and lateral forces) depend on 2 factors:

- Relative air/ball velocity

Relative velocity takes into account the wind velocity (if any) and the ball velocity. A ball leaving the club at 100 mph with a 30 mph head wind, has a 130 mph relative velocity. If the wind is a tail wind, then it is only 70 mph velocity. 

All forces are related to the square value of relative velocity. Therefore diferences in wind velocity will create even greater differences in effects and carry distances. 

It is very important to understand that lateral effects (draw, fade) are multiplied with velocity. Additionally, a lower spinning ball may help to keep the ball flying straight in windy days. 

- Air density

Air density is the other key variable in ball flight. In this case, it is a linear influence (half the density, half the force). 

Lower air density will reduce drag and increase distance, but it will also reduce lateral forces and reduce workability (draw, fade).

Air density is influenced by: Temperature, Humidity and Pressure (Altitude). 

Higher temperatures mean lower density. Warmer days will increase ball flight and reduce lateral effects

Higher humidity means lower density. Humid days (contrary to the general opinion) will increase ball flight and reduce lateral effects.

Higher pressure means higher density. Pressure depends on temperature, but is most noticeable in changes in altitude. Higher altitude means lower pressure, and lower density (increased ball flight and reduced lateral forces). Sea level will see greater density, and therefore shorter ball flight and increased lateral effects. 

Dimple pattern effect

Of course, the number, size, depth, and distribution of dimples matters. Although I am not an expert in aerodynamics, the general rule of thumb is that the greater the surface coverage with dimples, the better. This usually leads to dimples of different sizes that allow for greater coverage. 

Fortunately, some scientists have published some conclusions. You can find the full article here:

https://www.dl.begellhouse.com/journals/52b74bd3689ab10b,622ede1536cd09e2,1d6f10f3366ac391.html

As discussed previously, an efficient dimple pattern will decrease forces (increase ball flight and reduce effects). The authors in the reference paper, discussed dimple depth:

- Deeper dimples will increase forces

Since the carry distance depends on the trajectory described by the ball, lower launch angles will benefit from increased lift. Therefore the authors concluded that the carry distance for small launch angles benefit from deeper dimples (high swing speeds) while greater launch angles benefit from shallower dimples. 

Golf ball selection based on local conditions

Obviously golf ball selection depends on many factors and one should take the MyGolfSpy golf ball tests as a starting point for it provides unvaluable information on the characteristics of each ball. 

However, some local factors are often overlooked by amateur golfers when choosing a ball to play on a certain day:

- Players may benefit from a lower spinning ball in windy days (reduced unwanted lateral effects, more control)

- Players may benefit from a lower spinning ball in cold days (reduced unwanted lateral effects, more control)

For players in full control of their effects, the amount of lateral distance travelled by the ball (draw or fade) will increase in windy and cold days.

Cleaning and replacing the ball

As mentioned before, the ball's surface is critical for its performance. Any change in those surface characteristics can have a significant effect in its flight.

- Dirty ball: A dirty ball (mud) will have two consequences. Quite probably the efficiency of the dimple pattern will be reduced, and therefore the drag will be increased reducing carry distance.

Additionally, an irregularity in the balls symmetry will increase the lateral forces (Magnus effect) and cause an irregular flight and potential greater dispersion in the line. 

- Scuffed ball: A scuffed ball will present once again irregularities on the surface and may increase drag and lateral forces. (I presume that a strong impact with a tree or wall may also have some changes in the mechanical characteristics of the ball, triggering its replacement)

This was empirically demonstrated by this test by the MyGolfSpy Labs

CONCLUSIONS

1) You do not need to understand all this

2) You may play fantastic golf without knowing all this

3) Some of this knowledge is relevant and may be useful in your golf game

 

Disclaimer: A lot of this knowledge has been collated from several sources, and some of it has its foundations in my physics background. However, fluid mechanics and aerodynamics are very complex issues. I have not done any testing myself, and I am sure that ball manufacturers have a deep understanding and knowledge of this issue, and I could be wrong in some of my assumptions (especially about ball flight dynamics regarding optimal flight trajectory). However, I believe that most, if not all, of the contents presented here are correct. Many of them are factual. Please do not blame me for disasters in the golf course. Use at your own risk 

 

Edited November 8, 2023 by SpanishHands

[SpanishHands]

9 minutes ago, ZoonORama said:

Done that….

My hero

Edited November 8, 2023 by SpanishHands

[vandyland]

Well started out on the putting mat using a ProV1, ProV1x and the “test” ball. There wasn’t a ton of difference in feel for me between the ProV1 and the test ball but the X I had felt harder/harsher. So was unsure on this first go round if there was a true difference off the putter between the standard proV1 and the test ball.
 

Then it was outside for 1/2 wedges with the trusty old cleveland cg12.

Just the proV1 vs the test ball. Again, they seemed to go back and forth as to which one felt “softer”. I will have to get outside at the chipping green tomorrow to see if they react differently. 
 

 

[MH15]

On 11/7/2023 at 10:01 AM, MH15 said:

I am really excited to be a tester for this year!

Just got these bad boys in the mail yesterday - already booked some sim time for this evening. Hopefully I'll get some useful data up against my typical ball, the Bridgestone e6. The plan is to (hopefully) get out on a course sometime in the coming weeks. Might be challenging with the lack of daylight, but we will see!

More to come tonight!

A Quick Introduction

What's up everyone! I am Mark, and this is my first time getting to test a product for MGS and really in general, so thanks to Titleist and MGS! Very excited to be included in this one and hopefully more in the future!

I have been playing golf since I was a kid, but really became passionate and upped my frequency of play around the time of covid where I got to play almost daily at a local course that a buddy worked at.

I joined a league this year where I finished in 3rd place for individual rankings and 5th as a team. Excited to get back out there in league play once the weather in Chicago allows for it, hopefully in early April (or late March, one can hope!)

My handicap is probably around 18 - I have never have gotten an official number though. I plan to change that next year. My best round this year (and ever) was an 83 at a 71.7/122 rated course... admittedly, I'm not quite sure what that means. I also shot a 38 thru 9 at my league, securing a first place for the week and a good final push towards that top 3 finish. 

This winter, I hope to get a monthly membership for a sim to stay in "golf shape" and to hone in some of the areas that need improvement!

Testing Results!

I am going to go over a few things as well as some of the data. To me, there are 3 main categories for a golf ball: Looks, Feel and Performance. I got to test these with a Trackman at a PGA Superstore which was pretty cool.

*Disclaimer* - I am not the most consistent golfer, meaning I may sometimes hit my 7i 156 yds and then turn around and hit it 150 yds. Usually, the difference isn't drastic, but just thought I'd preface this review with that bit of info!

 

Looks: 6/10

This ball is just so extremely average looking. There is nothing wrong with that by any means. I didn't feel wowed or underwhelmed, more indifferent. The reason I mention this as a factor in my review is because I am a firm believer in the fact that if you are enjoying the ball you're playing and WANT it to perform well, more likely than not you will find ways to make it perform well. That being said, my testing was entirely objective for this ball. I'd give it a 6/10 - I can appreciate the deeper dimples for what I would assume to be higher spin capabilities. It is a pass in my opinion on the looks, nothing spectacular but nothing negative.

 

Feel: 7/10

I usually play softer balls, such as the e6 or occasional Supersoft. This ball did not feel as hard as a high end harder ball such as the pro v1, but also not as cheap as a something like a velocity. It felt like a good balance of clubface feedback without feeling like I'm hitting a stone or a very clicky cheap ball. It provided significantly more feedback than my e6, which admittedly feels like hitting a marshmallow when pured. I would say the feel was slightly above average - I immediately knew a good strike vs poor strike.

 

The Numbers: 5/10

The data just does not allow for me to give this ball an outstanding score here. My process was to hit about 7-8 shots per club (7 iron, PW, and Driver in that order) then to eliminate the 2-3 shot outliers that were shanks or chunks, etc... Averages below per club and per ball.

 

Bridgestone e6

 

 

What I gather from this is that the Driver is probably the most telling of the results. The Titlelist gave a significantly higher average spin rate of about 450 rpm, hence the steeper land angle. This cost me about 8 yds total on average. My drives tend to run out quite a bit, so this makes sense to me. I go for a lower spin rate in a ball to eliminate a slice or "strong fade" as I prefer to call it.

What surprised me with the 7 iron was the higher spin rate out of the Titleist, but also 5 yards total more on average. I thought the higher spin would be a steeper land angle, which it was, but I was just hitting it further for whatever reason. 

Both the e6 and Titleist performed almost identical on my PW. The Titleist, as mentioned in the feel portion, gave more feedback as to when I thought it was a spinny shot as opposed to the consistent soft feel of the e6. I can imagine that people with more spin control than myself would enjoy that.

 

Final Thoughts/Score: 18/30

I am not saying this ball is bad by ANY means, it is actually quite an impressive ball - just not for my play style currently. I imagine this ball would best suit the shot shaper and spin controller, who likes a semi-soft ball with feedback that almost provides immediate constructive criticism. For me, however, I cannot justify switching over to this ball despite its superior shot feedback. Also, what would probably deter me is the price point. I imagine that this is a middle to high end model in the Titleist repertoire, which would probably run $30+ per dozen. The e6 at ~$25 per dozen is just unbeatable for me. 

 

Feel free to let me know if you have any questions! This ball is great, just not for me! Thanks again to Titleist and MGS!

Edited November 8, 2023 by MH15

[jbern]

2 hours ago, ZoonORama said:

Done that….

Glad you did it so I don't have to! Thank you!

[ZoonORama]

5 minutes ago, jbern said:

Glad you did it so I don't have to! Thank you!

I’m here for the people….