Are You Better or Worse?

[GPS111]

Better than I think I am and for some false indicators.  Any layoff at my age (70) and you can feel the restart.  The result is an easier and slower swing with that restart.  If I roll with it and club up for the difference then it seems to work out but the mind still wants to hit the 150 yd 8 iron and I tend to default to it then overseeing or swing hard.  Not the game and I suffer as a result!  I need to let the game loosen up over the startup weeks so I can too.

[chisag]

1 hour ago, Jnoble89 said:

This is it for me. I played baseball in college until injuries ended my career and I picked up golf. I wasn’t a super high level player, but with baseball, I could put the ball wherever I wanted in the strike zone, whenever I wanted and largely struck out or got a put out on the majority of hitters I faced. Golf is the only sport I’ve played that hasn’t come natural to me. I would probably say I fall into thinking I SHOULD BE better than I am, but if I realistically look at it, I have never played enough year to year to actually see solid improvement. I have a membership to the CC in my hometown this year with full golf privileges, so I am really hoping that I can make some strides on improving my consistency shot to shot this year. With being able to play more than once per week and utilize the driving range, I’m hoping to be able to make some swing changes stick with repetition. I have kicked around the idea of starting a thread chronicling my journey to lowering my handicap once the season starts here in WI. 

 

... I have posted this before but it is a good reminder for this thread. I can't remember who it was but a PGA player was talking about playing in the 80's and he started to really struggle with his swing getting too mechanical. He decided to take a week off and just showed up the next Thursday without any practice rounds, hit a few balls to warm up before teeing off and just played golf. He won that week. He figured why not do it again? So he did and won two weeks in a row. 

... He said he had been working way too hard and getting himself confused and decided he wouldn't practice anymore and just play golf. 2 weeks later on a Friday walking up the 18th and missing the cut by 5 strokes he said he finally came to the realization that the golf swing isn't something you ever own, you just borrow it for short periods of time. So even the very best in the world struggle just like everyone else. Chip Beck shot a 59 and then couldn't make a cut and lost his card. It is a very difficult game and only a handful can play at a high level week in and week out. 

[Tim W]

I stopped playing for 5 years - terrible knees. Retired moved to Mexico. Found an Acupuncturist and can play again.
Bought recycled clubs sight unseen. No real way to buy used clubs in Baja. Have had them fitted in the US.
Putting in the work on golf and strength exercises.
Now am 30 to 50 yards shorter.   Still in fairway mostly.   Not scoring well.   Putting is better.   Short game is worse.
Went from 5 handicap to 12.  10 shots per round look like the old me. Driving accuracy remains.
Love the game. Hate my game at times.
Expectations may be too high.

Do not want to give in to an old man's swing and game! 

[GolfSpy_KFT]

25 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... I have posted this before but it is a good reminder for this thread. I can't remember who it was but a PGA player was talking about playing in the 80's and he started to really struggle with his swing getting too mechanical. He decided to take a week off and just showed up the next Thursday without any practice rounds, hit a few balls to warm up before teeing off and just played golf. He won that week. He figured why not do it again? So he did and won two weeks in a row. 

... He said he had been working way too hard and getting himself confused and decided he wouldn't practice anymore and just play golf. 2 weeks later on a Friday walking up the 18th and missing the cut by 5 strokes he said he finally came to the realization that the golf swing isn't something you ever own, you just borrow it for short periods of time. So even the very best in the world struggle just like everyone else. Chip Beck shot a 59 and then couldn't make a cut and lost his card. It is a very difficult game and only a handful can play at a high level week in and week out. 

Golf is easily the most challenging sport, or really any hobby/activity, I have done. That is also part of what makes it so fun to me. My ultimate goal is to someday be able to score consistently in the 80s. I'd love to say I'll some day score in the 70s or maybe even score even par on one round, but if I never do it won't bother me. I feel like, as others have stated, there is a better golfer somewhere hidden away in my mind/body, so that is what I'll keep searching for! I've done some lessons and fittings and I know with my most recent driver fitting, my fitter could hardly believe that I consistently scored in the low 100 range based on how my swing looked. That was also a day where I was swinging really well. Something to be chasing improvement wise is always fun.

[gingerbeast87]

I seem to be horrendously inconsistent when I play. I get too excited when I play and start to rush. Because I'm still fairly early into playing regularly i still get over excited. I get too much into my head when I make a bad set of shots, and then too excited when it starts to go well

 

[Placasse61]

I agree with Chisag "I will always think I can be better than I am, while striving to get there".  After 41 years I finally started keeping my handicap 3 years ago. Though I am a 22.4 I feel like I am much better. Keeping the index has made me think about the round, at the 19th hole, so instead of being disappointed on the score I look at the extra strokes I made and how they came about.  My rounds/scores are consistently derailed by at least 4 blowup holes. It is funny because when they happen, I know where I went wrong but can't seem to correct the 2 problems as they are happening. "Focus my AADD" (Adult ADD) and "trying to match big hitters" which I will never be able to do. If I can fix those two issues on a regular basis, I will score the way my mind thinks I can play, but then again "I will always think I can be better than I am" ............

[Tallwood88]

I think our handicap index is the fairest measure of how good are. But I think we all have it within us to do better. Fred Couples said in an interview that one thing he sees when playing amateurs is they don't give themselves enough credit for the good shots they hit. Even if it is only a few shots a round, be really happy about a shot that went as planned because even the pros don't hit them all as planned. This past fall I was playing with the club pro. I was in a fairway bunker about 150 to the pin, uphill, protected by a bunker and a mound in front., meaning I wanted to carry it over that bunker and mound and not go off the back. I hit a 6 iron to within 4 feet of the pin. He was so excited for me. "Do you how good that shot was?!! The pros don't hit it better than that!" That was the best shot I made all year because I knew how to do it, visualized it, and executed it perfectly. That doesn't happen very often. But when it does, it keeps us coming back.  I've come to expect not so much perfection on the course and enjoy the game as much as I can. For a 66-year-old 15 handicap that plays 25 - 30 rounds a year and rarely practices, that is what it is all about.

I made the putt, BTW.

[juspoole]

I feel like I am better than I think I am.  I have high expectations on my golf game, but when it gets down to it, I feel like I am very humble about my golf game.  

I have plenty of areas I can improve, most of which is getting in trouble off the tee at times.  But most other elements are pretty solid.  One part I feel like is a bit of a weakness is putting, but my buddies will say how great of a putter I am.  That's one really cool element to golf is that so much of it is mental and about confidence.  

I think my mind is a strong asset for me as well during rounds.  It can certainly turn with a few bad shots in a row, but overall I am very good about staying in each shot.

Another thing with golf, is there is always something to get better or improve upon.  You can never be idle.

 

 

[Beakbryce]

I think I am about where I am. Mid to high 70's shooter and have been for 35 years. I play all year round and don't really practice although I am about to pull the trigger for a net and launch monitor so I can wack it all day on my porch. That doesn't mean I don't have bad days, weeks, or a month. But when I do I "fake it until I make it". May be delusional but as long as I think I am shooting well, I find that I actually began shooting well. Let me be clear, I don't keep a handicap or play in tournaments where a deluded score would be frowned on. Some would say I am only cheating myself but I say I believe in the power of positive thinking because it works. It is after all only a game. 

What do you'all think? 

[rkj427]

Well after thinking about this topic for a while, I would be in a similar "mindset" as Tom the Golf Nut. A little background is needed to understand why I am saying what I am saying here.

My career path has always made me have an analytical mindset, where I had to understand the issue or problem, find true root cause and then take corrective actions to ensure it shouldn't happen again.

Still working, a lot of hours, even though I am more than old enough to retire, as I am good at what I do, enjoy the people or 3 person team I work with the majority of the time, and am in fairly good physical shape/condition for my age.

Still as long off the tee and the majority of people 25+ years younger than me, more due to equipment changes, physical shape and playing golf in a similar manner for the last 50+ years.

Started young, and even with a long break, still like riding a bike, you never forget the basics, or you shouldn't.

Iron play for me has always been a strong suit, and with age my FIR has improved dramatically.

I try to play the course "strategically" where if I miss, I try to leave myself in a position out of "big numbers" or trouble lays.

Don't always hit each and every shot perfectly, but always seem to play safe rather than sorry. Limit the big numbers, and scoring decently is a realistic expectation for me.

However, course conditions here vary greatly, and the biggest concerning area would be traps. Like Tom mentioned, some courses have decent or playable conditions, while others may be clay, rocky, or very hard packed dirt.

Although I work long hours, I do have the opportunity to practice "chips" and greenside shots out around my yard, and as the season starts here in the spring in the mid-west, I typically will spend time at a local range, and the few first times I go out, I try to play with just irons to get repeatable swings in rather than thinking about any score that day.

And I always try to play one shot at a time, take the results good or bad as they are given, and ALWAYS try to enjoy the time outdoors playing a game that is incredibly challenging.

[Andrew75]

Golf has never adequately repaid my superior skills. I doubt it ever will. 

[Dweed]

I think I'm better than I give myself credit for, especially early in the season.  I still surprise myself with some shots during the round. I do question why I can't repeat it every time but I do show myself I have that potential.  All it takes is one decent shot in the round to keep me coming back the next time. Even after a bad round, 1 good shot.

[mackdaddy]

Fun topic!  I have changed my golf life by taking a new job last year.  I have been as low as a plus 2.4 handicap when I owned my restaurant.  I worked primarily nights and played up to 5 days a week then.  I now play only on weekends because of my work schedule and my handicap has climbed up to 2.4.  I work for the school system and have summers off.  During the summer I can get my handicap back down to about scratch.  I know that the more I play the better I score.  My confidence in my yardages goes up, my feel for wedge shots gets much better and I putt like I own the hole because my pace control is very strong when I play more.

[Will_Mac]

I just noticed that my handicap in my profile still reads 1.9 (I'll get to changing it but can't see how to do that on the phone). Well, that was a few years ago. Now I'm at 5.9.

Long story short, epidural shots in early 2019 took away the pain, but pain and the fear of it was also my natural swing limiter. So my once compact swing very unintentionally became longer and longer until it was a sloppy mess and completely out of sequence. And because my back fails on me more often than in the past, forgoing the shots is not an option.

My handicap hit a high of 8.2, but being soft-capped for a long, long while, it should've been considerably higher. Twas a tough, prolonged stretch.

My low was 1.2 in 2018, and I know that I'm capable of getting at least down to 2 or 3 again. I've since found a path back by finally identifying what I need to do, but exorcising the bad habits has been a 2 steps forward, 1 step back process. But, I'll take it!

So do I think that I'm better than I am? Nope. The last few years of spiraling frustrations have hammered home the reality of my present game. But I still believe that I'm capable of finding my way back.

And I will.

[Kenny B]

I must be worse than I think I am.  Most of the time I can hit most fairways, get on or close to greens, and putt decently.  However, for some reason I find ways to really screw up rounds without taking any penalties.  Some of it is mental; some of it is LOFT.  I can hit all the shots, but can't put it together often enough to bring my index down.

[GaryF]

I think I have a pretty good grasp and realistic outlook of my game and strength/weaknesses, but if I had to choose one of the choices you posed, I’m slightly better than I think I am.  I’m late 60s, and for most of my life, I was unofficially a mid-20s hdcp based on what others ‘guessed’ when we played in scrambles. In hindsight, that was probably about right.  After sinking to desperation about 4 years ago and for the first time, taking some lessons, I fundamentally changed my swing, and for the first time, understood basic swing fundamentals.

I’ve always worked in highly technical fields and by nature am very analytical, so seeing various swing parameters was not only enlightening, but a pathway for me to understand what I needed to work on, and why.   Over the course of the next year, I started to keep a hdcp using GHIN, and have been in the 11-13 range ever since, with an avg score if 84.4. I feel I have a lot of room for improvement, especially putting where I avg 34.5.

As I mentioned, when I took the lessons I was at a crossroads.  Up until that time, after a layoff, I felt I could manage a round after 3-4 range sessions, but this time, I couldn’t hit anything. In those days, I felt intimidated and somewhat embarrassed I wasn’t a better player. That would usually lead to a lot of frustration.  

During my first lesson, we talked a lot.  He then asked a series of questions to assess whether I was willing to make changes, practice, and stick with the changes, then asked me what my goal was,  I told him I wanted to be respectable, and have a hdcp below 20.  I’ll never forget his response ‘with your current swing, you don’t have a chance’.  We both laughed, then he said, let’s get started.  He didn’t make the remark to be hurtful or discouraging, but rather to impress on me that to reach that goal, I had to make significant changes.  

This may sound strange, but some of my favorite aspects of golf are self evaluating, practicing, and learning.  I love to play, but I get a lot of enjoyment from being on the range as well as reading and studying. 
 

 

 

Edited February 10, 2023 by GaryF

[tony@CIC]

Am I better or worse...hmmmm guess it depends on the day, the hole on a specific course and or the club. Overall my drives are better along with my 3 wood but things get messed up in my head pretty quickly. Even at 76, my drives have consistently improved in distance and dispersion from a year or 2 years ago. I couldn't hit my 3 or 5 wood last year without topping it and dribbling down the fairway. One short lesson and they were fixed. 

I haver a mental problem with 2 holes at our club - I slice my drives into the water on those holes! My first thought when I get to the tee box is don't slice - and guess what - off it goes into the water! 

I finally have learned how to pitch & chip out of the Bermuda rough  - now I've got to get some distance control - although I did hole out on #9 from 40 yds for a birdie.  I haven't figured out Bermuda greens and am consistently losing strokes. I've got a lesson on Thursday and I sure hope he can diagnose what's going on. 

Then there's a tale of 9's. We played a shamble yesterday and I got a 43 on the front (helped by that birdie). We used a fair number of drives as well so that was good. I thought for sure the back would be even better since I tend to score better on the back - NOPE - I carded a 51 WTH. Ended with a 94. 

On the other hand even though I'm older my game hasn't gotten worse and some aspects better. I continue to play about 5800 yds. A number of guys my age I play with are playing combo tees = 4,700 yds. 

My expectations are probably messing with me. Before the spring is done I expect to be playing in the mid 80's so the journey continues!  

 

[Stuka44]

Very interesting topic.  I was on about 15 minutes after chisag posted this. And I've been pondering it since then.  I guess I've come to the conclusion that I think I am as good as I should be.  A big change occurred when I adopted the(for you Star Trek fans) Vulcan approach to the game.  After walking off after 9 holes(leaving my two brothers, and a friend behind) because I wasn't playing well, I realized I was A STUPID A-HOLE, and life was too short.

I can now take a 10 with a smile on my face.  I really just don't let anything about this game bother me any longer.  It has allowed me to be much more LOGICAL  about my game.  If I want to putt better, practice it.  I just need to apply this logic in other areas, more often.  Take less than driver off the tee on some holes.  So I don't put any undue pressure on myself about what I think I should do.  It is what it is, and its on to the next shot.

[GaryF]

On 2/7/2023 at 4:58 PM, stuka44 said:

Very interesting topic.  I was on about 15 minutes after chisag posted this. And I've been pondering it since then.  I guess I've come to the conclusion that I think I am as good as I should be.  A big change occurred when I adopted the(for you Star Trek fans) Vulcan approach to the game.  After walking off after 9 holes(leaving my two brothers, and a friend behind) because I wasn't playing well, I realized I was A STUPID A-HOLE, and life was too short.

I can now take a 10 with a smile on my face.  I really just don't let anything about this game bother me any longer.  It has allowed me to be much more LOGICAL  about my game.  If I want to putt better, practice it.  I just need to apply this logic in other areas, more often.  Take less than driver off the tee on some holes.  So I don't put any undue pressure on myself about what I think I should do.  It is what it is, and its on to the next shot.

I used to often get very upset and frustrated, and after significant improvement with lessons, I stay pretty even keeled now.  If I make a bad shot, I allow myself about 15 seconds to be upset, then just focus on the next shot.  I rarely have 2 bad shots in a row.  With my hdcp, I’m going to get a lot of bogies, so a bad shot isn’t a killer if the focus is on making a decent recovery rather than a hero shot.  I’ve played with some friends that have spent the better part of a round playing ‘mad’, and the deterioration of their game is so obvious. 

Edited February 9, 2023 by GaryF

[Bang60]

Ahhh I was a 9 marker when I played with my healthy mind body, after a month in a Coma my concentration is poor at best. I can hit the ball well but half the time I just hit the ball with no thought of what I'm trying to do, my preshot routine is not there so I can hit it fat thin and good shots. I need more thinking about what I'm doing but with my mind blank from time to time that is very difficult...

[Bang60]

I played today and did better, 47 is my best practice 9 for some time. The 2nd is 164metres par 3 and I've hit my Fav Widex 5wood 19* 166metres on to the green 3metres past the pin just missed birdie, landed just short and run on. I actually started with my ebike even though I'd forgotten the battery, knackered after 3 holes pushing the ###### bike and I tried to remind myself 10mins before I left home to put the battery in my van. If I'd put it at the door I would of seen it and put in the van, out of sight out of mind lol lol

[Franc38]

I think I'm worse than I think I am... But I score much better than I feel like I play, most of the time.

So because I can relatively frequently play shots that wouldn't look out of place on a PGA tour tournament, I figure in my mind that I should be at the very least a scratch golfer. The problem being that my bad shots, which do happen possibly more often to me than to the average scratch, are waaaaayyyyyy worse than their bad shots. Plus my putting is reliable... reliable in not putting the ball in the hole at any distance longer than 10 feet! So net, I'm worse than what I think/feel I am or should be.
On the other hand, I often feel like I'm playing an absolute rubbish round only to realise that I'm 2 over after 12 holes and that's far from terrible... Well, then I usually shot a +3 on a hole just to remind me of my station

[Dweed]

On 2/7/2023 at 4:58 PM, stuka44 said:

I can now take a 10 with a smile on my face.  I really just don't let anything about this game bother me any longer. 

Well done. Best of luck in your future games. Enjoy.

 

[GPS111]

On 2/7/2023 at 1:58 PM, stuka44 said:

Very interesting topic.  I was on about 15 minutes after chisag posted this. And I've been pondering it since then.  I guess I've come to the conclusion that I think I am as good as I should be.  A big change occurred when I adopted the(for you Star Trek fans) Vulcan approach to the game.  After walking off after 9 holes(leaving my two brothers, and a friend behind) because I wasn't playing well, I realized I was A STUPID A-HOLE, and life was too short.

I can now take a 10 with a smile on my face.  I really just don't let anything about this game bother me any longer.  It has allowed me to be much more LOGICAL  about my game.  If I want to putt better, practice it.  I just need to apply this logic in other areas, more often.  Take less than driver off the tee on some holes.  So I don't put any undue pressure on myself about what I think I should do.  It is what it is, and its on to the next shot.

Amen brother.  If your are ever in the Seattle-Everett, Washington are let me know.  Be fun to play.  First beers on me!

[Bang60]

On 2/8/2023 at 10:58 AM, stuka44 said:

Very interesting topic.  I was on about 15 minutes after chisag posted this. And I've been pondering it since then.  I guess I've come to the conclusion that I think I am as good as I should be.  A big change occurred when I adopted the(for you Star Trek fans) Vulcan approach to the game.  After walking off after 9 holes(leaving my two brothers, and a friend behind) because I wasn't playing well, I realized I was A STUPID A-HOLE, and life was too short.

I can now take a 10 with a smile on my face.  I really just don't let anything about this game bother me any longer.  It has allowed me to be much more LOGICAL  about my game.  If I want to putt better, practice it.  I just need to apply this logic in other areas, more often.  Take less than driver off the tee on some holes.  So I don't put any undue pressure on myself about what I think I should do.  It is what it is, and its on to the next shot.

I can promise your not alone being stupid on the golf course or anywhere else, LOGIC IS the answer wish I could practice it more often...

[silver & black]

I avoided this topic for a while to think on how to respond.

 

I am not even close to the player I used to be. I am older. I have lost distance.  I no longer practice or take lessons. I play every Wednesday on league (9 holes) and every Sat/Sun with my brother (18 holes). I drink too much beer while playing. I used to be a solid 8.3 HC. I am no longer close to an 8...lol.... maybe a 10/12 by my calcu;ations, as I no longer keep a valid HC.... I shoot mid to low 80's most of the time.... while recording around 5/6 rounds in the 70's in a season these days.

Do I care? Hell no! After what life has dealt me over the last 9 years, golf scores are the last thing I worry about...lol.  

Just have fun out there. Relish your time with your friends and family out there. I understand that we/you want to score as well as we/you can.  I still "try" to play as well as I can when I play, but it isn't the all encompassing thing that it used to be for me. I was a fairly decent player in years past. I am no longer the player I once was. So be it. The sun comes up in the morning... and I still have to go to work...lol.

 

 

 

Edited February 9, 2023 by silver & black

[Bang60]

6 minutes ago, silver & black said:

I avoided this topic for a while to think on how to respond.

 

I am not even close to the player I used to be. I am older. I have lost distance.  I no longer practice or take lessons. I play every Wednesday on league (9 holes) and every Sat/Sun with my brother (18 holes). I drink too much beer while playing. I used to be a solid 8.3 HC. I no am longer close to an 8...lol.... maybe a 10/12 by my calcu;ations, as I no longer keep a valid HC.... I shoot mid to low 80's most of the time.... while recording around 5/6 rounds in the 70's in a season these days.

Do I care? Hell no! After what life has dealt me over the last 9 years, golf scores are the last thing I worry about...lol.  

Just have fun out there. Relish your time with your friends and family out there. I understand that we/you want to score as well as we/you can.  I still "try" to play as well as I can when I play, but it isn't the all encompassing thing that it used to be for me. I was a fairly decent player in years past. I no am longer the player I once was. So be it. The sun comes up in the morning... and I still have to go to work...lol.

 

 

 

Good for you doing it your way, I believe you do anything you like providing your actions don't hurt anyone else...

[GaryF]

On 2/7/2023 at 11:37 PM, Bang60 said:

Ahhh I was a 9 marker when I played with my healthy mind body, after a month in a Coma my concentration is poor at best. I can hit the ball well but half the time I just hit the ball with no thought of what I'm trying to do, my preshot routine is not there so I can hit it fat thin and good shots. I need more thinking about what I'm doing but with my mind blank from time to time that is very difficult...

Just take it one step at a time and you’ll find little ways to get your concentration back.  When you say you hit the ball with no thought, that’s probably how you always played but you subconsciously had the ‘feel’.  It’s probably still there, just buried a little deeper and hopefully over time, it re-emerges.  

I just finished watching the Netflix documentary about the White Island volcano.  Just heartbreaking, but at the same time heartwarming in regards to those that helped with rescue. 

[Bang60]

3 hours ago, GaryF said:

Just take it one step at a time and you’ll find little ways to get your concentration back.  When you say you hit the ball with no thought, that’s probably how you always played but you subconsciously had the ‘feel’.  It’s probably still there, just buried a little deeper and hopefully over time, it re-emerges.  

I just finished watching the Netflix documentary about the White Island volcano.  Just heartbreaking, but at the same time heartwarming in regards to those that helped with rescue. 

This kinda makes sense, like the par 3 I hit 5wood and it felt great.. Nice draw I've seen on TV many times, I'll try to do it more with feel, thanks..

[Stuka44]

17 hours ago, silver & black said:

Just have fun out there. Relish your time with your friends and family out there. I understand that we/you want to score as well as we/you can.  I still "try" to play as well as I can when I play, but it isn't the all encompassing thing that it used to be for me.

Right there with you!   See my post above.  Only way to be.  I practice when I can, still trying to improve, and do the best I can.  But  if I blow up, OH WELL just doesn't effect me anymore.