Thoughts on "Soft" Balls - GD Ball Hot List

[GolfSpy Barbajo]

So the Golf Digest Hot List for balls is officially out, and it's obvious the new trend is soft balls (keep the Deflategate talk to a minimum - lifelong Pats fan here!).

 

Here's the link -- it's a pretty good read....

 

So what are your thoughts on "soft?"  I've been going back and forth between the Srixon Z-Star, the Nike RZN Black, the Wilson Duo Spin primarily -- with a few others thrown in for good measure.  Gotta say, the 35 compression of the Duo Spin is nice -- the others are noticeably harder, but both are pretty good balls.  Heck, even the ProV's are getting softer.

 

Can you feel the difference? Do you feel there's a performance difference?  Is this yet another trend that is a distinction without a difference?

 

 

[fozcycle]

The new Maxfli Softfli also is a 35 compression ball......Lately Dick's has been offering it at 2 for $25.....that's a great deal if you are interested in Low compression golf balls.  I played it beside last year's Wilson Duo at 35 comp and liked the action and feel of the Maxfli much better.

 

I have been alternating between the Maxfli Softfli, the Titleist DT Solo & the Hogan Edge....all low compression.....all under $20/dozen!

[Mr_Theoo]

I'm guessing Brady liked the Wilson ball the most because it was softer than the rest

[mnfats95]

I'm guessing Brady liked the Wilson ball the most because it was softer than the rest

 

Ha, nice!

 

I play the Wilson Duo when it's cold and I love it.

[hckymeyer]

If your balls get too hard I'd recommend seeing the urologist.

 

I've played the Duo in cold weather, but I hate the feel of it.  It's like hitting a marshmallow off the tee.  I have no idea what the compression is, but I much prefer the Tour Preferred X, Prov1 X or Snell My Tour Ball to any of the low compression offerings.

[GolfSpy Dave]

really liking the Duo Spin this season. Would like a touch more check with it around the green, but once you play for the roll out it's not that much of an issue. I still like playing the Wilson Zip too, though that one has even less short spin. 

[JohnBarry]

I love watching girls softballs

[Kenny B]

Not a Duo fan; agree with hcky that it feels like hitting a marshmallow.  When it get cold, I have found that the Bridgestone Lady Precept works for me and I like Yellow because when it's cold. it's usually gray skies.  For the rest of the year, I'm probably sticking with the MG Tour C4 because it plays like a ProV1 to me and is $20/dozen.  I will be trying the Snell My Tour Ball this weekend, so we will see which one gets the most play.

[Kor.A.Door]

Chrome Soft. Great feel. Long off the tee. Soft at the green

[silver & black]

Project a. I have no idea if it's a "soft" ball or not. I just like it.

[Baseballfrk8998]

I don't have much experience with any of these balls but I have played a Chrome Soft for a few holes. It has a fantastic feel off of the putter face. Unfortunately, that's about all that I remember about it.

[revkev]

Why in the world did you start this thread with this group? 

 

Alright since you decided to start a thread on deflate gate here are my thoughts.  Football got what it deserved and should bring suit against itself.  How could you begin to expect that if you left those balls in the hands of teams there wouldn't be those who would skirt the rules?  It would be like sending 150 type A personalities off into the woods with no one watching and say, "Don't improve your lie or anything!"

 

Oh wait, there's another thread about that.

 

In regards to the ball we've learned from Dean Snell that this is about the core.  I'm not quite sure whether or not it has a great impact on performance.  Green side spin is about the cover.  So even though the Duo feels softer there's no way it's going to spin as much around the green as a Pro VIx or the king of firm the Bridgestone B330.  

 

I don't know it all seems gimmicky to me.  Ball makers hit golf once they were able to meld distance and spin (by creating a truly smart ball.)  The only down side was the ball felt firmer, close to a distance ball.  For most amateurs that meant we got additional spin with the same old feel.  For once it was the pros that had to adjust.  Now there is an entire generation of guys on tour and an entire group of amateurs that are used to a firmer feel.  If you can somehow convince all of us that the softer feel is better (true or not) it becomes fools gold.

 

So I'd like to see spin rates, launch angles, etc., hard numbers, that's what I'd like to see.  Does the softer feel equate to performance or not.  If it doesn't then preference is all that matters, if it does and that performance fits my game profile, I'm interested.  Ultimately going to a softer feel would be a huge change for me.  I didn't often play balata because of the distance loss.  I needed those 15 extra yards to compete.  I just played different shots around the greens from those who would play balata.

 

Maybe we could get Dean over here to comment.

[Kenny B]

I do think that balls like the Duo fit golfers differently.  I guy at our club is a big, old, strong dude who has bad knees but gets lots of distance through tremendous upper body strength.  He hit the Duo a long way and loves it.  I tried it and hated the feel of it (the marshmallow effect).  I felt like I hit it well, but it never went anywhere; way less than Z-Stars, PV1s, and MG Tour C4.  I even hit the Bridgestone Lady Precept further.  

 

I barely remember the balata ball, since that was about the time I started playing golf but a friend of mine played them religiously.  The Titleist Professional had just come out when I started and it was available in 90 and 100 compression.  Nice balls but didn't last that long.

[ZenGolfer]

Soft can be a good thing but for me personally, too soft can be a bad thing.  I remember playing the Srixon Q-Star when it first came out and I hated it because it felt like I was playing golf with a marshmallow.

[Mr_Theoo]

Has anyone else noticed a loss of distance with the softer balls when it gets hotter outside? I noticed it last year with the project a.

[revkev]

I play in hot weather almost exclusively Mr. Theo and I do not hit those soft feel balls as long as I do the Pro VIx type of balls.  That's across the board. 

 

Kenny and Badger Golfer illustrated my point nicely - thanks guys.  There are very few Amateur golfers around who remember when pro level balls felt soft and fewer still that used them because they were costly, didn't hold up well (remember smiling balls?), were hard to control unless you were a very good player (more spin, more slice) and they weren't nearly as long 15-20 yards shorter than their surlyn covered counter parts. 

 

So to switch to a softer feeling ball at this point would be crazy for most of us unless there were evidence that it improved performance.  Perhaps it means decreased spin with the driver - that would be a reason to switch.  Increased spin around the green might be a reason although to be honest playing with balata was always an issue for me.  I'm a moderate spin player.  I can't suck a tour ball back much but I spin it, you can tell I'm spinning it.  I would such a balata ball back.  It would be another factor to figure out.

 

I'm smelling a sales pitch from the OEM's here - softer feel, you have to have it.  Why?  Tell my why and fit it to improving my game in a meaningful way and I'll give it a try.

[Undershooter]

I play in hot weather almost exclusively Mr. Theo and I do not hit those soft feel balls as long as I do the Pro VIx type of balls.  That's across the board. 

 

Kenny and Badger Golfer illustrated my point nicely - thanks guys.  There are very few Amateur golfers around who remember when pro level balls felt soft and fewer still that used them because they were costly, didn't hold up well (remember smiling balls?), were hard to control unless you were a very good player (more spin, more slice) and they weren't nearly as long 15-20 yards shorter than their surlyn covered counter parts. 

 

So to switch to a softer feeling ball at this point would be crazy for most of us unless there were evidence that it improved performance.  Perhaps it means decreased spin with the driver - that would be a reason to switch.  Increased spin around the green might be a reason although to be honest playing with balata was always an issue for me.  I'm a moderate spin player.  I can't suck a tour ball back much but I spin it, you can tell I'm spinning it.  I would such a balata ball back.  It would be another factor to figure out.

 

I'm smelling a sales pitch from the OEM's here - softer feel, you have to have it.  Why?  Tell my why and fit it to improving my game in a meaningful way and I'll give it a try.

I wonder what I could've done with a balata ball if I went back to X100s lol. I could suck an 8 iron back 20+ with the old x100s. No chance I could control the spin with the Balatas.

 

As far as the low compression balls go I liked them but they were a little shorter off the driver and I couldn't figure out how to exclusively play roll out shots with my short game.

[revkev]

You couldn't believe how far the Tour guys were sucking the ball back with Balata Undershooter.  It's what caused them all to learn to take more club and hit a dead armed shot - they often needed to take spin off of the ball.

 

I'll tell you the other thing with those balls, miss hit them and there was tons of distance loss (or gain if it were a blade.)

[wbealsd]

Half our playing season is in "colder" weather, so I generally play softer balls in the spring and fall, but once the temps warm up I switch.  I don't like the feel of "soft" off the putter and with a slower swing speed, distance gains/losses aren't as big a factor as how a ball feels and performs in my short game.

[Undershooter]

You couldn't believe how far the Tour guys were sucking the ball back with Balata Undershooter.  It's what caused them all to learn to take more club and hit a dead armed shot - they often needed to take spin off of the ball.

 

I'll tell you the other thing with those balls, miss hit them and there was tons of distance loss (or gain if it were a blade.)

I've seen some old video but don't really remember what was normal. Either way I don't think I would've been good at controlling it.

[dsnell19]

Interesting topic here.  I remember when I started in R&D, tour balata was the ball of choice... alittle confession here, although the balls said 90 and 100 compression on them, they were really much lower.. some of them even in the 70's...but back then, if someone said 80 compression, it was considered a ladies ball.. then comes the EV extra spin.. SD90.. HP2 Tour...Noodle.. all of these balls stared to push 2-pc firm distance balls into the lower, softer compression.. so the compression labels came off the boxes and we stopped talking about them.  Wound balata balls would spin like crazy.. I remember tour players actually using 6 and 7 degree drivers to try to keep the spin down. but boy did they love the feel... they felt that they could control the ball better.. that it stayed on the face longer...which it did... then we did Professional.. wound ball with first cast urethane cover.. compression increased to mid 80 and low 90... but spin dropped with drivers so they went further.. so players gave up a little feel for more distance.. then comes PROV1... even lower spin off driver so again longer... and compression creeps mid 90.. B330, Callaway HEX Rule 35, prov1x.. all come along and again push compression up to around (and some over) 100... so slow process over 10 years to have players give up on the preferred feel to gain the distance.. now today, distance is pretty much max'd out.. we are at the limits for ball speed.. for overall distance.. and tour balls and 2-pc balls have around the same spin rates.. so therefore they all go about the same distance.. the days of 30 yards gains are gone.. so technology has allowed us to make cores softer and softer without losing ball speed... used to be if compression of cores were softer, the speed was slower.. but we have new technology used today that can have 50 compression cores be same speed as 90 compression cores.. and the lower core compression helps lower the spin rate... so feel is on its way back to the discussions...I do not ever think the tour balata feel will come back... lots of golfers today have never experienced this level of feel at all.. and for tour players that I have work with do not want it to be that soft.. they think if real soft, then in their mind, shorter in distance..  for the 2-pc low compression balls listed in this thread, I would make sure you test these out on the short game.. low compression 2-pc balls have a tendency to feel softer, but have very low spin.. so around the greens where most need spin to help stop the ball, these balls will be the lowest and tend to roll out more... so, long story (sorry for that) short, feel is very subjective from player to player... find something that you prefer along with the performance, not just the feel..and test them from 100 yards and in.. where you play most of your golf... do not worry about swing speed and compression.. they all go around the same distance off the tee.. 

[revkev]

I find this entire discussion fascinating.  I left another golf forum and came to MGS a little over 3 years ago primarily because I wanted to know more about golf balls.  That forum was too small to have any sort of meaningful discussion - I remain friends with all of the active guys there but don't visit for any serious discussions.  In fact I've noticed a couple of the guys surface here - one is in on the Wilson ball test - I'm hoping he gets selected.

 

It's remarkable to me that we've gone from soft feel = more spin to soft feel = less spin. 

 

Callaway is marketing its tour ball as a softer feel ball but the reality is that's the only benefit if I'm interpreting Dean's reply correctly.  For me I prefer the firmer feel that I've played all of my life.  The Pro VI was the one golf equipment advance that benefited me more than it did a guy on tour and I'm not giving up on that ball type until such time as something truly better comes down the pike. 

 

Okay perhaps the advances in mowers has benefitted me greatly also.  But I think that the ball has more. 

[alfriday101]

I play in hot weather almost exclusively Mr. Theo and I do not hit those soft feel balls as long as I do the Pro VIx type of balls.  That's across the board. 

 

Kenny and Badger Golfer illustrated my point nicely - thanks guys.  There are very few Amateur golfers around who remember when pro level balls felt soft and fewer still that used them because they were costly, didn't hold up well (remember smiling balls?), were hard to control unless you were a very good player (more spin, more slice) and they weren't nearly as long 15-20 yards shorter than their surlyn covered counter parts. 

 

So to switch to a softer feeling ball at this point would be crazy for most of us unless there were evidence that it improved performance.  Perhaps it means decreased spin with the driver - that would be a reason to switch.  Increased spin around the green might be a reason although to be honest playing with balata was always an issue for me.  I'm a moderate spin player.  I can't suck a tour ball back much but I spin it, you can tell I'm spinning it.  I would such a balata ball back.  It would be another factor to figure out.

 

I'm smelling a sales pitch from the OEM's here - softer feel, you have to have it.  Why?  Tell my why and fit it to improving my game in a meaningful way and I'll give it a try.

 

 

This is interesting.  I don't think I've ever been accused of being crazy before.  

 

Feel is one characteristic of the ball.  Some golfers may not care about the feel, while others care about it a great deal.  It is not "crazy" to prefer one over the other, it is just a preference.  Just as some golfers prefer a high spin ball to a low spin ball, or vice versa, each will choose what they prefer.  I'm not going to use a soft ball that is inferior for my game to a harder ball, but if one performs about the same, I'm going with the soft feel.   

 

And I doubt it is some grand conspiracy by the OEM's.  After all, the same companies make and sell the rocks as make the soft balls.  

[fozcycle]

Well said Dean,

 

As I read your historic prgression, I relived the balls I played, from 1950's to taday.  With the wound ball, we wanted a crisp smack, followed by a lot of carry & roll. As soon as we had a mishit. the smile emerged and we were looking in the bag for another ball.

[revkev]

Alfriday I'm glad you're here. I never mind being called out but please just call me out for the right thing. So, I will point out the most of us in my post and preference that follows. Some may prefer the softer feel all things being equal No doubt. But given that very, very few of us would remember the truly soft feel of balata the number is likely to be small. Many will think the ball isn't going as far or describe the feeling as mush off the driver.

 

And yes it remains my contention that it's a snake oil move on the part of some OEMs. How is softer better for a player's game? What's the tangible benefit in terms of spin rate, ball speed, stability, launch angle, those things that will impact score?

 

I would buy an ad that says, delivers the same qualities as ... for players that prefer a softer feeling ball. Why wouldn't some players prefer that? if it were true my crazy remark would be crazy. But the jury is out there. From what I'm reading these balls won't do that as yet. They don't deliver spin around the green. That's my point, would you give up performance for feel? To me that's crazy. Not everyone has the same goal when they go to the course though so perhaps unproductive towards shooting the lowest possible score over time is a better choice.

 

For now, without some data based evidence, this sounds like the square driver to me.