Which is worse?

[WholeinOne]

Which do you think is worse? Not fixing ball marks on the green or not replacing divots in the fairway?

I am continually perplexed at the number of unfixed ball marks on greens. I make it a practice to fix mine and look for another one to fix.   If one cannot take 15 seconds to fix their ball mark on the green that inconsiderate person should not be allowed to play. 

[Tom the Golf Nut]

Not fixing ball marks on the green bothers me the most. Having a putt go off line due to a ball mark is unacceptable. Fairways are much larger and your odds of being in one are less. 
However they both should be fixed.

[Stuka44]

I view not fixing ball marks as much worse.  Because if one happens to be in my way I have to fix it.  I have to be honest for many reasons some of which have been discussed on this forum, I just do not play out of divots, and take free relief for myself.  Unrepaired ball marks just aggravate the S*** out of me.  Especially lately.  My brother and I are still playing here in NE Ohio, well maybe not this weekend we got 8 inches of snow yesterday.  Golfers who are playing in this much colder weather, should be regular, dedicated golfers who ABSOLUTELY SHOULD KNOW FREAKING BETTER.  Two Saturdays ago I literally fixed 12 gouging ball marks on one green, 35 others besides mine for 18 holes.

I actually created a sign after that day to take with me the next time we went.  He chose not to hang it up, I can't see why not.  "  If you are playing golf on this course, at this point in the YEAR, then YOU SHOULD KNOW BETTER!  If you cannot FIX YOUR BALL MARKS, THEN DO US ALL A FAVOR, AND FLIPPING STAY HOME.

SINCERELY! A GUY WHO FIXED 35 BALL MARKS LAST SATURDAY THAT WERE NOT HIS OWN!!

Every course should furthermore not allow someone to pay for a round of golf, give them a scorecard, or a pencil to keep score with, until they physically produce and show a repair tool they have in their pocket, or they have to buy one.

[Blaine Dye]

My motto is i want to leave the spot i hit from better then i found it if its putting like at my course some people try to fix there ball mark and end up making it worse  by making a huge hole then patting it down 

[cnosil]

1 hour ago, Stuka44 said:

Every course should furthermore not allow someone to pay for a round of golf, give them a scorecard, or a pencil to keep score with, until they physically produce and show a repair tool they have in their pocket, or they have to buy one.

I don’t have my repair tool in my pocket until I get to the first tee.   But, all I have to show you is a tee; that is an effective repair tool.   Therefore, everyone has a tool with them; the problem is they choose not to use it.  

 

2 hours ago, WholeinOne said:

Which do you think is worse? Not fixing ball marks on the green or not replacing divots in the fairway?

Fixing greens should be the priority.   In my area we have Bermuda fairways so you have to sand fill. The problem is the sand containers are frequentlyempty so that is a course issue.  Also a problem for walkers since they don’t have a sand bottle.    I will admit that when it is cart path only, I pretty much never take the sand bottle with me.  

20 minutes ago, Blaine Dye said:

 it if its putting like at my course some people try to fix there ball mark and end up making it worse  by making a huge hole then patting it down 

Is it worse to not fix the pitch mark or to incorrectly fix it?  

[GolfSpy_SHARK]

Definitley not fixing the pitch mark. Fairway like @cnosilsaid its tough if you do not have the sand/seed bottle (which I would like to purchase for my push cart for this reason) but typically any pelt I take gets put back but the fairway also grows back and is little easier to get back. 

Greens are unacceptable to not be fixed and when I played a few weeks ago, not sure why this time of year, but there were a TON of pitch marks in the green, blew my mind.

[russtopherb]

Both drive me nuts but it's the pitch marks on the greens that are worse. Seems like I always end up fixing 2-3 marks per green when I get up there. It's maddening. 

[Blaine Dye]

personally i think its worse to not fix it but i always try to do more then just mine 

[chisag]

... I don't like them but I can hit out of a divot but I can't recover from a putt moved off line by an unseen poorly repaired ball mark. I saw a sign at a course I played on vacation that said something like it takes one to two days to heal properly repaired ball mark if repaired within 10 minutes. It takes 3-5 days if it is repaired within 1 hour. It takes several weeks if the ball mark is not repaired until the next day by the maintenance staff. It had pictures to show the damage and levels of healing. Hard to ignore it but of course some do. I would add it is brutal when someone is trying to do the right thing but doing it the wrong way. Hard to believe I still see good players insert their repair tool or tee under the ball mark and lift, then tamp down. This of course leaves those tan spots with dead grass on the greens because they have severed the grass roots and the grass dies.

... Here is a video just in case you were never taught the proper technique:

 

 

[CB Lobo 4 Life]

Absolutely without a doubt not fixing ball marks on greens. Like others have said everyone carries a tee in their pocket and it is so easy to do! Fairways are certainly an exception. I try my very best to fix the divots I create but most often like others our sand containers are empty and there is the occasional time that your divot was blown to pieces and not very recoverable. In all, there is nothing that pisses me off more than fixing my ball mark to then see 4+ others I need to repair. It takes such a short time and makes such a difference to the course and the experience. 

 

[DaveP043]

I don't disagree with those who say its worse to leave unrepaired pitch marks than it is to leave un-replaced divots.  But the flip side of this is that you ARE allowed to repair pitch marks and other damage on the Putting Green, while you are NOT allowed to replace a divot if it improves the Conditions Affecting the Stroke in other parts of the course.  Doesn't that make it a worse offense to do something that a player isn't allowed to fix?

[ParFore74x]

I agree with everyone else on this one, unrepaired ballmarks on the greens drive me nuts. Literally takes just a few seconds to do properly. The worst is when I’m behind others who I recognize as regulars at the course and they are not fixing their marks when they know better. 

[cnosil]

1 hour ago, chisag said:

... I don't like them but I can hit out of a divot but I can't recover from a putt moved off line by an unseen poorly repaired ball mark. I saw a sign at a course I played on vacation that said something like it takes one to two days to heal properly repaired ball mark if repaired within 10 minutes. It takes 3-5 days if it is repaired within 1 hour. It takes several weeks if the ball mark is not repaired until the next day by the maintenance staff. It had pictures to show the damage and levels of healing. Hard to ignore it but of course some do. I would add it is brutal when someone is trying to do the right thing but doing it the wrong way. Hard to believe I still see good players insert their repair tool or tee under the ball mark and lift, then tamp down. This of course leaves those tan spots with dead grass on the greens because they have severed the grass roots and the grass dies.

... Here is a video just in case you were never taught the proper technique:

 

 

Could also go with the Augusta National recommendation

https://golf.com/news/how-augusta-national-repairs-ball-marks/

 

[chisag]

4 minutes ago, cnosil said:

Could also go with the Augusta National recommendation

https://golf.com/news/how-augusta-national-repairs-ball-marks/

 

 

... Pretty interesting technique. Thanks for posting that. I carry the ole scotty repair tool and am so used to using it with a gentle push to the center, then tamping it down and it is almost impossible to find it again. But every now and then I forget my repair tool and use a tee, so next time I will give the Augusta method a try. 

[funkyjudge]

10 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... Pretty interesting technique. Thanks for posting that. I carry the ole scotty repair tool and am so used to using it with a gentle push to the center, then tamping it down and it is almost impossible to find it again. But every now and then I forget my repair tool and use a tee, so next time I will give the Augusta method a try. 

I carry a divot tool with the single prong that looks exactly like that blue one with the LaCosta logo on it in your earlier post. Thus, I can do the "Augusta National style" divot repair, which I will try doing in my tournament round tomorrow.  I actually prefer the single-prong divot tools, and I have a couple of steel ones in addition to my favorite plastic version with the logo of my home golf course on it (almost worn out from frequent use).

[chisag]

6 minutes ago, funkyjudge said:

I carry a divot tool with the single prong that looks exactly like that blue one with the LaCosta logo on it in your earlier post. Thus, I can do the "Augusta National style" divot repair, which I will try doing in my tournament round tomorrow.  I actually prefer the single-prong divot tools, and I have a couple of steel ones in addition to my favorite plastic version with the logo of my home golf course on it (almost worn out from frequent use).

 

... I have been carrying the same Scotty repair tool for a good 10 years now. I have a spare in my bag just in case I lose this one but so far the ole timer is a little worn around the edges but still going strong. It has become 2nd nature as I am so used to using it. I will add we need something very sturdy in winter because the greens get harder and the ball marks are shallow but the ground is very firm. It can be tough to get a tee in the ground on the tee box.


 

[ParFore74x]

35 minutes ago, cnosil said:

Could also go with the Augusta National recommendation

https://golf.com/news/how-augusta-national-repairs-ball-marks/

 

I like that technique. Biggest thing that it proves is how easy it truly is to fix a ball mark so no one has an excuse as to why they don’t fix their own. 

[hckymeyer]

From a course recovery perspective....Not fixing ball marks on the green is worse.  Takes longer to recover if not fixed, or not fixed properly.  Our GM did a test and took 3 divots on the side of the range.  Replaced one, seeded one and left one untouched.  All took about 2 weeks to recover.

From a playing the course perspective...  I can fix ball marks on the green, but I can't fix divots in the fairway.  So I'd rather my ball have a ball mark in the way than be in a divot.

Personal perspective ... Not fixing a ball mark is worse.  There's just no reason not to fix it other than pure laziness.  A divot may not be fixed if you didn't take the roots, or ran out of sand/seed, or the pelt kinda blew apart on you.

[chisag]

13 minutes ago, hckymeyer said:

here's just no reason not to fix it other than pure laziness.

 

...  And I would add selfishness. I have seen really good players not fix their ball marks. Like everything in life and as I have posted over and over again it almost always comes down to one simple explanation. People are either considerate or inconsiderate. It explains so many things. Music at a low level or loud enough for other groups to hear a fairway over. Keep carts 30 feet from greens a tees or drive them right up to the fringe. Play in 4 hours or 4:50 minutes without ever looking behind them. Replace their divots or take another practice swing after a bad shot and replace neither divot. And don't fix their ball marks or fix theirs and at least one other. We have trash baskets on every single tee box but I still find crushed beer cans tossed into the desert. Considerate players think "what's wrong with them?" and the reality is they really just don't care. 

[Preeway]

2 hours ago, ParFore74x said:

I agree with everyone else on this one, unrepaired ballmarks on the greens drive me nuts. Literally takes just a few seconds to do properly. The worst is when I’m behind others who I recognize as regulars at the course and they are not fixing their marks when they know better. 

My all time pet peeve for sure. When I caddy I intentionally wait until the players get closer to me so they can see how I repair ball marks. Drives me nuts when I'm raking a bunker and I see them using a two-prong tool and lifting the ball mark up, clearly destroying the roots. Cringeworthy but so many people don't know how to do this correctly.

[GaDawg]

3 hours ago, chisag said:

 

...  And I would add selfishness. I have seen really good players not fix their ball marks. Like everything in life and as I have posted over and over again it almost always comes down to one simple explanation. People are either considerate or inconsiderate. It explains so many things. Music at a low level or loud enough for other groups to hear a fairway over. Keep carts 30 feet from greens a tees or drive them right up to the fringe. Play in 4 hours or 4:50 minutes without ever looking behind them. Replace their divots or take another practice swing after a bad shot and replace neither divot. And don't fix their ball marks or fix theirs and at least one other. We have trash baskets on every single tee box but I still find crushed beer cans tossed into the desert. Considerate players think "what's wrong with them?" and the reality is they really just don't care. 

Sam I occasionally play with a guy who is the Senior Champion (60+) at my club. Very good ball striker, but does some lazy stuff in my opinion. Our greens are fairly firm most of the time and he never ever repairs a ball mark, he will tap it down with his putter, but will not attempt to correctly repair it. I go behind him and repair his ball marks and he questions what I am doing, but too lazy to change his ways. The first to complain when he has to put though one that someone else failed to repair. 

The other strange things are:

• Rakes the bunker, then places his ball in a prefect lie when he gets in one. (Brags about how he gets up and down)
• If you are away when putting, when you putt and miss a couple of inches, he will rack your ball over next to his mark and putt it in. Then walks away, leaving you to pick up your ball from the cup.
• Never ever let's anyone play through, but the first to call the pro shop if he's being held up.
• Does not believe in giving strokes in a match. Gets pissed when I ask him what the H/C system is for.

[Dweed]

Nothing new from anyone else. My vote is not fixing the ball marks on the green. Easy to do. I've volunteered at courses as a ranger and one of out duties was to walk the greens and repair ball marks. That takes a bunch of time, even with a repair tool.

[Josh Parker]

On 11/29/2023 at 3:57 PM, chisag said:

 

... I have been carrying the same Scotty repair tool for a good 10 years now. I have a spare in my bag just in case I lose this one but so far the ole timer is a little worn around the edges but still going strong. It has become 2nd nature as I am so used to using it. I will add we need something very sturdy in winter because the greens get harder and the ball marks are shallow but the ground is very firm. It can be tough to get a tee in the ground on the tee box.


 

I carry a couple of these as well.  I think I fix half a dozen or so on every green I walk on.  I know our greens are struggling until they get the funding but I don't understand why people don't fix them. 

Divots are the same way. I will fill them if I am near one.  At the 10th green there is a spot to refill the bottle if it's needed. 

 

[Preeway]

Instead of a forked tool, I use a single prong device or a tee. I’ve found it to be less prone to tearing the ground. But either way, really wish more people would just take 5 seconds to fix theirs and another 5 seconds to fix one more. 

[DaveP043]

On 11/29/2023 at 4:57 PM, chisag said:

 

I have no doubt that you use these properly, but to me they tempt less well-trained players to use them as a lever, pulling up the center of the pitch mark, instead of nudging the surrounding grass towards the center.

[chisag]

4 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

I have no doubt that you use these properly, but to me they tempt less well-trained players to use them as a lever, pulling up the center of the pitch mark, instead of nudging the surrounding grass towards the center.

 

... Sadly that is true Dave. My 81 yr old pard used it this way when we first started playing together. He thought that knob was a lever instead of a place to put your thumb when you gently pull. LOL, he didn't believe me til I sent him several videos with the proper technique (same as I showed him) and how lifting breaks the roots. He is a great guy and very considerate, always replacing divots and "repairing" others ball marks so it was a huge disappointment for him to find out he had been doing wrong all these years. 

Edited December 1, 2023 by chisag

[fixyurdivot]

Both are bad but I suppose those on the green are worse - simply because they are so easy to repair.  I make it a habit of finding and fixing my own and at least one other... and, sadly, I never have a challenge finding more than one.  I typically use the time while folks are getting to the green or sizing up putts to do my handywork.

[Swood1994]

Joining the majority here. Not fixing your ball mark on the green is by far the worst for me. It varies course to course on whether they want you to even replace the divot in the fairway. I’ve played some where they want you to fill it with sand and leave the sod out of the divot. But every course expects you to replace your ball mark. 

Depending on the speed of the round I try to fix 2-3 extra balls marks as I come across them on my way to line up my putt. Respect the course and the course respects you!