Sweeping Four from the Yankees

[NiftyNiblick]

I don't hate New York.
 

Every trip to Manhattan in my lifetime has resulted in a good time.

 

But Manhattan hasn't had a team since the Giants left the old Polo Grounds after the 1957 season.

 

MY RED SOX JUST SWEPT FOUR FROM THE 2ND PLACE YANKEES.

 

At least something in the universe is upside up..

[Charli]

Yeah this weekend hurt my heart

[NiftyNiblick]

Yeah this weekend hurt my heart

Sorry, Chuck.

 

That's the nature of sports, isn't it?

 

Somebody's happy.  Somebody's pissed. 

 

We've both been on both sides of that, I'm sure.

[00sportsman]

Sorry, Chuck.

 

That's the nature of sports, isn't it?

 

Somebody's happy. Somebody's pissed.

 

We've both been on both sides of that, I'm sure.

Yes, we have. We have more than Yankees fans, haven't we. Bucky Bleepin Dent, anyone?

 

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[NiftyNiblick]

Bucky ******* Dent, and even Aaron ******* Boone, were pretty much purged from my mind by the 2004 ALCS.

[RickyBobby_PR]

As a yanks fan it sux seeing how they have gotten away from plate discipline and playing hard. Cashman has his yes man on the bench and the team has no accountability for their actions. Good thing is it's entertainment and like every other Monday it's back to work and daily life.

[NiftyNiblick]

Good thing is it's entertainment and like every other Monday it's back to work and daily life.

 

The best part of being a geriatric Red Sox fan after a four game sweep of the Yanks....

 

it's Monday morning, I'm pouring my second cup of coffee, sitting in my wife beater and baggy boxers, browsing the web, and not even thinking about going to work.  It almost makes being decrepit worth it.

[Charli]

Zero plate discipline. I get being aggressive if the report says the pitcher always throws first pitch strikes.

[Charli]

And yes nifty this is what makes this rivalry Fun.

[Mr. 82]

I pause before writing any of these words, but here goes.

 

The Yankees were a big reason why I lost (complete) interest in MLB altogether back in the 90's and early 2000's.  The vast disparity in franchise payrolls between the Yankees and everyone else back then pretty much sent the message that there was no chance of a small market team like Oakland having the same opportunity to compete on a level playing field with teams from the big markets, like the Yankees, and Red Sox.  Seeing the Yankees win the AL East year after year, and then the World Series over and over again, while other teams continuously floundered in obscurity, due mostly to the inability to field a competitive team due to cost limitations mostly brought on by overspending by the Yankees ultimately left me with one option - stop watching the game altogether.

 

Now I realize that a lot of my argument above has been rendered false in the past 10 years or so as teams like the Royals have claimed titles, and the event known as "hell froze over" happened when the Cubs won a title, took place.  But I still have a very bitter taste in my mouth by the arrogance and opulent spending of the Yankees, and to an extent, the Red Sox.  I don't hold as much ill will against the Red Sox, mostly because their fans were long suffering due to the curse of the Bambino, but still the bitterness remains pretty much in tact.

 

Fast forward to my odyssey just last month to Atlanta in an attempt to try and see a Braves game in person, and MLB once again became irrelevant and completely out of my mind, at least in even knowing who was playing who, when and who was leading in the standings, or not.  In fact, I couldn't tell you a single player on just about any team any more (Bryce Molder plays for the Nationals I think?).  I think that last comment tells you all you need to know.

 

My apologies if this is considered thread jacking, but anytime I even see a mention of the Bronx Yankees, I generally yell out or speak silently in my mind two very foul words that aren't "Merry Christmas".

[NiftyNiblick]

I pause before writing any of these words, but here goes.

 

The Yankees were a big reason why I lost (complete) interest in MLB altogether back in the 90's and early 2000's.  The vast disparity in franchise payrolls between the Yankees and everyone else back then pretty much sent the message that there was no chance of a small market team like Oakland having the same opportunity to compete on a level playing field with teams from the big markets, like the Yankees, and Red Sox.  Seeing the Yankees win the AL East year after year, and then the World Series over and over again, while other teams continuously floundered in obscurity, due mostly to the inability to field a competitive team due to cost limitations mostly brought on by overspending by the Yankees ultimately left me with one option - stop watching the game altogether.

 

Now I realize that a lot of my argument above has been rendered false in the past 10 years or so as teams like the Royals have claimed titles, and the event known as "hell froze over" happened when the Cubs won a title, took place.  But I still have a very bitter taste in my mouth by the arrogance and opulent spending of the Yankees, and to an extent, the Red Sox.  I don't hold as much ill will against the Red Sox, mostly because their fans were long suffering due to the curse of the Bambino, but still the bitterness remains pretty much in tact.

 

Fast forward to my odyssey just last month to Atlanta in an attempt to try and see a Braves game in person, and MLB once again became irrelevant and completely out of my mind, at least in even knowing who was playing who, when and who was leading in the standings, or not.  In fact, I couldn't tell you a single player on just about any team any more (Bryce Molder plays for the Nationals I think?).  I think that last comment tells you all you need to know.

 

My apologies if this is considered thread jacking, but anytime I even see a mention of the Bronx Yankees, I generally yell out or speak silently in my mind two very foul words that aren't "Merry Christmas".

The Red Sox and Yankees can spend money on players because Bostonians and New Yorkers buy lots expensive tickets and cable TV packages. 

 

At over $100 for a ticket and six fifty for a hot dog, in-person baseball isn't for the working class anymore. But if the players weren't paid at all, the prices would still be the same--what the market will bear--and the owners would make even more money.

 

The fault isn't with the players or the owners.  If you want to blame somebody, you have to blame the customers willing to spend that kind of money.  There's no law that says that we have to worship at the altar of unfettered free enterprise, but as long as we do, the small market teams may occasionally come up lucky but will mainly exist to be "opponents" like the Washington Generals for the Harlem Globetrotters.  Many people in the small markets go to the games to see the stars on the Red Sox, Yankees, Dodgers, and Cubs. When they play one another, it's close friends and family night.

 

Just the messenger, here.

[Kor.A.Door]

Can't stand either team. Half or more of the players on both teams are from other teams that don't have the “market share” to be able to pay the players that they bring up. Once these players become good and should be paid, the teams don't have the resources to pay them. So they end up at the yankees or Red Sox who have more money to spend than they know what to do with. Baseball has a huge flaw, Lack of revenue sharing. The percentage give too much to the big market teams. They need to do what hockey did, and make everything even. No super teams unles you can get guys to play for less money, and in some cases they do because they want to win. Baseball teams purchase their championships, they don't build them.

[Mr. 82]

The Red Sox and Yankees can spend money on players because Bostonians and New Yorkers buy lots expensive tickets and cable TV packages. 

 

At over $100 for a ticket and six fifty for a hot dog, in-person baseball isn't for the working class anymore. But if the players weren't paid at all, the prices would still be the same--what the market will bear--and the owners would make even more money.

 

The fault isn't with the players or the owners.  If you want to blame somebody, you have to blame the customers willing to spend that kind of money.  There's no law that says that we have to worship at the altar of unfettered free enterprise, but as long as we do, the small market teams may occasionally come up lucky but will mainly exist to be "opponents" like the Washington Generals for the Harlem Globetrotters.  Many people in the small markets go to the games to see the stars on the Red Sox, Yankees, Dodgers, and Cubs. When they play one another, it's close friends and family night.

 

Just the messenger, here.

Yeah, I definitely agree with your points above.  I guess my rant was basically stemming from emotion, as I grew up loving to watch MLB and remember the classic World Series where the Dodgers and Yankees would go at it and loved rooting for the Dodgers when Steve Garvey was playing, and Tommy Lasorda was managing.  Those were some great years.  But then the whole money disparity sort of ruined it for me I guess.  I think when you are a kid you don't see the money side of things and just focus on what you see on the field.

[TheWahoo]

Living in Annapolis, my wife and most of my neighbors  are Orioles fans.   Regarding Boston and New York, I guess that they would rather not talk about it.    Me, while not a pro baseball fan, I pay more attention to the Nationals and the National League because they still play REAL baseball.  

 

Regarding money and pro baseball, I can remember Catfish Hunter making front page news because he got a million a year contract.  Darn, I must be old, but I got to live during a time when it was about the game and not the money.   That's why the American league has the DH, an effort to hopefully put more butts in the seats.

[RickyBobby_PR]

Living in Annapolis, my wife and most of my neighbors are Orioles fans. Regarding Boston and New York, I guess that they would rather not talk about it. Me, while not a pro baseball fan, I pay more attention to the Nationals and the National League because they still play REAL baseball.

Wahoo and the old timers and the real baseball thing.😀 Nothing like watching a pitcher flailing away like fish out of water while at the plate. Almost as bad as watching a guy well past his prime hold on to a career at DH.

 

Baseball should go back to lower mounds, no ear flaps or protective equipment and then let's see how good these 250 hitters getting multi million dollar yearly salaries are.

[NiftyNiblick]

Living in Annapolis, my wife and most of my neighbors  are Orioles fans.   Regarding Boston and New York, I guess that they would rather not talk about it.    Me, while not a pro baseball fan, I pay more attention to the Nationals and the National League because they still play REAL baseball.  

 

Regarding money and pro baseball, I can remember Catfish Hunter making front page news because he got a million a year contract.  Darn, I must be old, but I got to live during a time when it was about the game and not the money.   That's why the American league has the DH, an effort to hopefully put more butts in the seats.

Years ago, when our daughter was single, she and my wife took a trip to DC to look at the sights and visit the grave of a recently deceased relative at Arlington National.  While there, they took a side trip to Camden Yards for a Red Sox-Orioles game.

 

There were more Red Sox fans than Oriole fans there.

 

Splitting a fan base with the Nationals isn't the same as splitting a fan base with either the Senators that became the Twins or the Senators that became the Rangers. The Nationals have stolen fans.

[TheWahoo]

Years ago, when our daughter was single, she and my wife took a trip to DC to look at the sights and visit the grave of a recently deceased relative at Arlington National.  While there, they took a side trip to Camden Yards for a Red Sox-Orioles game.

 

There were more Red Sox fans than Oriole fans there.

 

Splitting a fan base with the Nationals isn't the same as splitting a fan base with either the Senators that became the Twins or the Senators that became the Rangers. The Nationals have stolen fans.

While I understand the logic of your post regarding the Nationals and stolen fans from Baltimore and there may be some truth to it, I am not sure such is the case.   I can remember during the time between the departure of the Colts and the arrival of the Ravens, Baltimore was on the short list for an expansion NFL team.   When Baltimore did not get a team, many immediately blamed Jack Kent Cook, the then owner of the Redskins.  However, Cook knew that he would never capture the hearts of Baltimore, there was a waiting list for season tickets and Redskin products would never catch on in Baltimore.   The reason that Baltimore did not get a team was Modell because he knew he wanted to move to Baltimore and that the City would sell its soul to get a team.   There is a certain rivalry between DC and Baltimore sports fans and they will not embrace each others teams.  The former Bullets now the Wizards are not high on the Baltimore fan list. 

[poprocksncoke]

Was an awesome week for MLB thats for sure!!!

[NiftyNiblick]

. Baseball has a huge flaw, Lack of revenue sharing. The percentage give too much to the big market teams. They need to do what hockey did, and make everything even. No super teams unles you can get guys to play for less money, and in some cases they do because they want to win. Baseball teams purchase their championships, they don't build them.

I couldn't disagree more.

 

The Red Sox and Yankee fans buy the cable subscriptions.

We pay the $150 or more for a single ticket.

We pay the two hundred bucks for a souvenir game jersey and the forty bucks for a souvenir fitted cap to wear to the games.

 

If the small market fans won't or can't do that, then maybe they're not really major league towns. Maybe they'll support AAA baseball.  Why should Red Sox and Yankee fans subsidize them?  Baseball isn't health care. It's not education. It's not an essential human service.  It's not something that needs to be shared or subsidized.

 

I don't even agree with baseball's luxury tax.  It's too much like the salary cap that lesser sports have.

 

Can you imagine how good major league baseball would be with just one, twelve-team league instead of thirty teams?

 

No more virtual exhibition games with flyover teams that play second fiddle to SEC or Big 12 football.  Do you know how big college football is in Boston or New York?  Neither do I. The Harvard-Columbia game draws 4,000 fans on a good day. That's the Northeastern sports fan's choice.

 

World class baseball for people who actually appreciate baseball would be something to watch..

 

OK, Nifty. You made some real fans with this one, but it had to be said.

[Mr. 82]

I couldn't disagree more.

 

The Red Sox and Yankee fans buy the cable subscriptions.

We pay the $150 or more for a single ticket.

We pay the two hundred bucks for a souvenir game jersey and the forty bucks for a souvenir fitted cap to wear to the games.

 

If the small market fans won't or can't do that, then maybe they're not really major league towns. Maybe they'll support AAA baseball.  Why should Red Sox and Yankee fans subsidize them?  Baseball isn't health care. It's not education. It's not an essential human service.  It's not something that needs to be shared or subsidized.

 

I don't even agree with baseball's luxury tax.  It's too much like the salary cap that lesser sports have.

 

Can you imagine how good major league baseball would be with just one, twelve-team league instead of thirty teams?

 

No more virtual exhibition games with flyover teams that play second fiddle to SEC or Big 12 football.  Do you know how big college football is in Boston or New York?  Neither do I. The Harvard-Columbia game draws 4,000 fans on a good day. That's the Northeastern sports fan's choice.

 

World class baseball for people who actually appreciate baseball would be something to watch..

 

OK, Nifty. You made some real fans with this one, but it had to be said.

You are actually making a really good argument and has me thinking about a few things.  First thing that popped into my mind is that for as strong as the support is for the Yankees and Red Sox, Syracuse doesn't even have a baseball program, mostly because the baseball season in college starts in mid-February when it's too cold up north and half of the northern teams have to travel south to Florida for the first month, and play most of their home games in the 2nd half of the season.

 

You are absolutely correct in that a lot of sports are regional.  I mean, we'll not be seeing NASCAR in the great Northwest anytime soon.  North Carolina absolutely goes nuts for college basketball, but couldn't give two flips about either baseball or football.  There are no pro sports teams in Alabama or MIssissippi, but yet they can fill a stadium with over 100,000 insanely passionate college football fans every Saturday in the fall.

 

There is some merit to your idea of shrinking MLB to fewer teams.  A good idea would be to take the bottom 6 or 8 teams after each season and demote them to AAA, and take the top 6 or 8 most competitive AAA teams from that same year and promote them to MLB.  So you get MLB in some towns where AAA is now, and it can be on a rotating basis year in and year out, based totally on your performance on the field.  That would be something I'd like to see honestly.  Can you imagine the chaos that would create if the Yankees or Red Sox suddenly ended up in the cellar one year, and they were demoted to AAA?  I'd pay good money to see that happen honestly.

 

Same idea for college football.  Let's reduce the number of bowl eligible teams and conferences to where it makes sense numerically and financially.  I mean, come on, when was the last time Vanderbilt or Kentucky won a darn thing in the SEC football season?  At the end of the year, the two worst teams in the SEC spend next season in another lower tier conference, and have now earned the right to compete next year for the right to be promoted back to the SEC.  This gives some smaller conference powerhouse teams from non-power five conferences promotion opportunities.  The top two teams from say the SunBelt end up in the SEC next year, just as a hypothetical.

 

Ultimately none of this will probably ever happen, because at the end of the day, like you said, money drives everything related to change in sports.  The one outlier in this is college football.  If money were truly driving that horse we would have had a 16 team post season playoff a LONG time ago, versus this ridiculous month of meaningless bowl games that we've been witnessing played for decades.  The fact that the college football programs and conferences haven't recognized how much revenue they are leaving on the table by not having an 8 or 16 team playoff just mystifies me.  I mean, call them whatever you want - bowl game or whatever, but the opportunity to host 7 or 15 individual "playoff" bowl games that all have meaning and significance has got to be in the neighborhood of a billion dollars in lost revenue for college football every year.  But I think once ESPN goes bankrupt and runs out of money, the landscape of postseason college football will dramatically change to offer something like this to happen.  But again, it's always about the money.

[RickyBobby_PR]

Can't stand either team. Half or more of the players on both teams are from other teams that don't have the “market share” to be able to pay the players that they bring up. Once these players become good and should be paid, the teams don't have the resources to pay them. So they end up at the yankees or Red Sox who have more money to spend than they know what to do with. Baseball has a huge flaw, Lack of revenue sharing. The percentage give too much to the big market teams. They need to do what hockey did, and make everything even. No super teams unles you can get guys to play for less money, and in some cases they do because they want to win. Baseball teams purchase their championships, they don't build them.

If I'm not mistaken there is revenue sharing and the last several years each team has received ~$45mil each so at a minimum each pay roll should be that because that's basically free money, then add in luxury tax for teams that exceed the $189mil/year payroll plus tv and endorsement deals. Granted large market teams have an advantage but there are lots of teams that don't spend money and after all it is a business and there's not one owner that is in it to lose money and there are some stingy owners who have money and choose not to spend it.

[Bosox04]

I am a life long Red Sox fan. Went to my first game in 1960. Since 2004 things have been pretty good, but I still remember disasters from the past. Just can't get too excited about a series in early August. Now, if they can eliminate the Yanks in the playoffs, I'll get excited.

[Rickp]

I don't hate New York.

 

Every trip to Manhattan in my lifetime has resulted in a good time.

 

But Manhattan hasn't had a team since the Giants left the old Polo Grounds after the 1957 season.

 

MY RED SOX JUST SWEPT FOUR FROM THE 2ND PLACE YANKEES.

 

At least something in the universe is upside up..

Maybe one more?

 

 

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[Rickp]

Maybe one more? IMG_1034.PNG

 

 

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I'm third generation New England, Boston Red Saux Fan and in lovin' it. My granddad never saw a serious Saux World Series run, my dad died a month B4 the Saux won in 2004. Now I have a serious baseball player & fan in my 12 year old grandson and he's Saux thru and thru.

 

 

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[Wedgie]

Back on topic it was a beat down. Too bad last nights comeback ended at 12:49am this morning otherwise more Yanks fans could have watched.

 

 

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