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Saints fans are going to have a whole nother postseason of living with a missed PI call...

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No shot they call that in OT. Ticky tack at best.


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I'm not saying it would have been overturned had they reviewed it or that they should have thrown a flag. I just found it odd they didn't even review it as there was a clear push off from Rudolph to create separation. I don't think it would have been a ticky tack call at all, personally. I'm fine with it as a non-call, but I'd have also been fine with it as a flag for OPI as well.

I was more just commenting that Saints fans aren't going to be too happy about losing back to back playoff games when PI could have been called (and absolutely should have in last year's game).



No shot they call that in OT. Ticky tack at best.


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I'm not saying it would have been overturned had they reviewed it or that they should have thrown a flag. I just found it odd they didn't even review it as there was a clear push off from Rudolph to create separation. I don't think it would have been a ticky tack call at all, personally. I'm fine with it as a non-call, but I'd have also been fine with it as a flag for OPI as well.

I was more just commenting that Saints fans aren't going to be too happy about losing back to back playoff games when PI could have been called (and absolutely should have in last year's game).


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Respectfully disagree. I used that move on every ball thrown to me for my entire college career. Watch any NFL game and it happens on just about every close coverage catch.


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Again, I'm not saying it doesn't happen a lot. It does. That doesn't make calling it ticky tack. Most of the time the arm is already extended however, which Rudolph's wasn't when he did push off which is the difference in my opinion in why I'd have been fine with it being called as OPI.


Respectfully disagree. I used that move on every ball thrown to me for my entire college career. Watch any NFL game and it happens on just about every close coverage catch.


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The thing I'm going to miss most about the Patriots dynasty is how much they got everybody else's panties in a bunch 


You hit the nail on the head. More posts about the Pats losing than anything else today. Reminds me of my nosy neighbor who worries about what everyone else is doing instead of their own boring problems and make it a point to point out flaws everywhere else.

I’m a third generation U. of Kansas grad so I’ve been listening to the same types complaining about Kansas basketball success my whole life. Weak Big 12, cheat to get players, yada yada yada. At least the Pats could close the deal more often than not.

The good news is the Pats aren’t going anywhere anytime soon so we will get to listen to this for about 4 more years when Belichick passes Shula in all time wins. Then all bets are off.



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Backup QB and the practice squad at WR and DB so not too upset with my Birds. Need to do some hard work in the off season in the front office.

And Clowney should be suspended for the hit on Wemtz but sire he will get a small fine and move on with his life. The


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Backup QB and the practice squad at WR and DB so not too upset with my Birds. Need to do some hard work in the off season in the front office.

And Clowney should be suspended for the hit on Wemtz but sire he will get a small fine and move on with his life. The


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Philly did a great job considering the injuries.


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Serious question to all of you Pats fans:

Do you honestly think all the rest of us NFL fans should respect your team over the last 20 years? I might get in trouble over this, but I liken this to how Trump is viewed. Strike that..... I will get trouble for that.

How about.............. way too much evidence that points out less than "honerable "intent??? My Raiders said after the BULLSHIT tuck call that it seemed like they knew every play that was called before the snap. Interesting, no? I wonder why?

As I said..... the Pats are/were a very good team. I just question the how and why of it after all the unscrupulous "allegations" over the years.... by many teams, not just the Raiders.

Flame away. I would expect nothing less.

 

 

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5 hours ago, Jmikecpa said:

I didn’t forget that but they weren’t up 33-0 and doing it just to be a pompous a$$.

 

And this is the defining argument as to why people outside of Massachusetts absolutely hate and despise the Patriots.  Let's look at the evidence shall we:

  • Kansas City rolls into Foxboro for MNF and puts the beatdown of a lifetime on Brady and the Pats, and all Bill Belichick can say in his (forced/mandatory) post game press conference is, "We're on to Cincinnati" about 10,000 times to any and all questions.
  • Last night after losing to Tennessee and a reporter asking an honest question about the future and Brady, and all Belichick can respond with is, "We're focused on this game today and not the future."

So which is it Bill?  Is it "on to Cincinnati" or is it today's game?  Frankly, I don't think it matters who asks the question, or what the result of the game was.  Bill Belichick has always been, and will always be a complete, cold, ruthless, rude, and frankly a horrible human being to any and all comers.

What really blows my mind is how a complete and total @$$hole that he is has so much success in a professional public environment where a big part of his job is media relations.  He's the only coach I know of who can completely give the middle finger to the media and keep his job.  It's not even a matter of "trade secrets" either, but merely all about him just going out of his way to piss on everyone and anyone that dares ask him a question about anything at all.  You could ask this man what his favorite meal is and he'd probably respond by saying rudely, "we're not discussing that today, we're focusing on the game."

But then he refuses to actually answer any questions about the game except to say, "they made more plays then we did, and we didn't make enough plays to win the game."  That might as well be the same as saying, "F you and everyone here for even trying to engage me in a presser.  All of you media people are ignorant morons, and you're beneath me to even talk to."

Bill Belichick goes against everything I was taught either growing up or as an adult.  I was taught to respect people, and treat people as I would want to be treated.  But this man goes around basically saying, "F You" to anyone in public and treats everyone like total garbage in public.  Anyone else would have lost their jobs years ago, but because this total jerk wins football games he gets a free pass.  There is no one else in the world who could do this, and that is what pisses me off about the New England Patriots.

 

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5 minutes ago, GSwag said:

All of you media people are ignorant morons, and you're beneath me to even talk to."

well............................

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33 minutes ago, silver & black said:

Serious question to all of you Pats fans:

Do you honestly think all the rest of us NFL fans should respect your team over the last 20 years? I might get in trouble over this, but I liken this to how Trump is viewed. Strike that..... I will get trouble for that.

How about.............. way too much evidence that points out less than "honerable "intent??? My Raiders said after the BULLSHIT tuck call that it seemed like they knew every play that was called before the snap. Interesting, no? I wonder why?

As I said..... the Pats are/were a very good team. I just question the how and why of it after all the unscrupulous "allegations" over the years.... by many teams, not just the Raiders.

Flame away. I would expect nothing less.

 

 

If the Patriots were truly a good team all these years, they would have an average margin of victory in all of their playoff games and Super Bowls that is greater than 2 points.  I don't think it's a coincidence that every Super Bowl win they've had is by 3 points or less.  Every playoff game is close.  That's because they cheat and steal and rob signals, signs, and deflate footballs however they please to tilt a level playing field to make sure they can squeak out a victory.

There is nothing wrong with your post.  Your arguments are valid. Patriots fans can just go suck it and they can now know what it feels like to have an early off season just like the rest of the NFL teams normally get.  I am hopeful that this is just the start of the downward spiral for that loathsome franchise.  I hope that Bill Belichick spends the next 5 years going 3-13 or worse as the rest of the NFL starts to rip apart his horrible playbook and manners and dish back to him what he's been screwing the rest of the NFL over with for the past 20 years.  Belichick will die old, alone, and with no one at his funeral.  We'll all be sitting around saying, "Sorry Coach, we've moved on to Cincinnati."

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Serious question to all of you Pats fans:
Do you honestly think all the rest of us NFL fans should respect your team over the last 20 years? I might get in trouble over this, but I liken this to how Trump is viewed. Strike that..... I will get trouble for that.
How about.............. way too much evidence that points out less than "honerable "intent??? My Raiders said after the BULLSHIT tuck call that it seemed like they knew every play that was called before the snap. Interesting, no? I wonder why?
As I said..... the Pats are/were a very good team. I just question the how and why of it after all the unscrupulous "allegations" over the years.... by many teams, not just the Raiders.
Flame away. I would expect nothing less.
 
 


I’ll take a shot at this but I grew up in Kansas a Chiefs fan but root for the Pats now that I live in New England. I think the tuck call was BS and the Raiders got screwed and you know any Chiefs fan hates the Raiders. My belief is most Pats fans think they walk on water and have never broken any rules. My household of born and bred Pats fans fall in the middle in that yeah, they have cheated, got caught, accepted the consequences and moved on.

I read an article today how Cower and Shanahan explained how they stole play calls in game and via video but that doesn’t get mentioned. The same article talked about how the Bills opened a gate or something like that to create a wind tunnel when opposing teams are going that direction. NFL caught them but no punishment because they were losing the games anyway.

The Trump analogy is probably pretty good in that you are on one side or the other and it is hard as hell to sway anyone the other way. Growing up a Royals fan I hated the Yankees and living so close to Boston it has only gotten worse but I sure did respect their team during the 90s. Did they cheat by taking steroids? I think the consensus is at minimum Clemens did and probably Petit, but so did a lot of other guys on other teams. Maybe that is where the Pats are, they broke some rules but so do a lot of other teams. Their success has magnified all of this but the guys on top are the ones we criticize the most, maybe that is just human nature. Maybe if the Astros won the WS this year after a 20 year run people would make a bigger deal about them stealing signs.

My best guess is that die hard New England fans could careless if they are respected by anyone else in the league like most other fans would be if it were their team.






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6 hours ago, FrogginBullfish said:

No one's saying they didn't benefit from a less than stellar division but it's nonsense to suggest that it's the only reason for their success, which some seem to be suggesting.

I posted this earlier in the year as a direct response to the same thing being said.

"People have been saying the Pats' reign is over every year since the 2014 season and they've only won 3 Super Bowls and been to 4 in that time.

Also, the idea that they've only been good over the Brady/Belichick era because of their division is just a flat out myth. In that timeframe, they have a better winning percentage against 4 other divisions than they do their own. Their winning percentages against the AFC and the NFC in that timeframe are practically identical.

Including the Patriots win totals, the AFC East also has the best win percentage for a division in that timeframe. Taking the Patriots wins out of the equation, yes, the AFC East has the lowest win percentage in that timeframe, but something interesting happens when you remove the division winner from every division and look at the win percentages then. The AFC East has the second best win percentage of any division in the league in that timeframe when looking solely at the performance of the 3 teams in each division that didn't win the division.

Going further and removing the best team from each division over that time period puts the AFC East as the 4th most winningest division in football in that timeframe. Far from the worst.

Here's the source: https://patriotsdynasty.info/blog/2019/01-02/myth-easy-afc-east-definitive-guide"

I'm not sure I understand how you think it had no bearing on their success? 
I'm not taking anything away from their accomplishments. I'm saying that the division they played in, more or less..... more, most of the time, allowed them six division wins almost every year. It allowed them home field advantage in the playoffs. It allowed them a first round by every year (I think) except this year. 
I agree that they beat the best to win their SB's, but you can't say the weak division had nothing to do with their #1 seading and home field advantage over the last 20 years.


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This is total BS.  How many other divisions over the past 20 years have seen one team win the division 18 years out of 20?  (NY Jets in 2002, Dolphins in 2008).  Since 2001, the Dolphins and Bills have made the playoffs as a Wildcard twice, with the Jets getting a Wild card 5 times.

Here are the playoff records of the three other AFC East teams since 2001

  • Miami Dolphins 0-3
  • Buffalo Bills 0-2 (including this year)
  • New York Jets 6-6

It was quite a few years ago, but Peter King from SI posted the winning percentages of all four AFC East teams since 2001, and the rest of the AFC East teams didn't even come close to winning as many games as the Patriots did COMBINED.  Basically it's not even debatable that the AFC East is the least competitive division in all of the NFL for the last 20 years.

Basically I will simply say that I look forward to the demise of the Patriots, and them returning to their 1970's status of doormat of the league.  That's where they belong at this point.

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If the Patriots were truly a good team all these years, they would have an average margin of victory in all of their playoff games and Super Bowls that is greater than 2 points.  I don't think it's a coincidence that every Super Bowl win they've had is by 3 points or less.  Every playoff game is close.  That's because they cheat and steal and rob signals, signs, and deflate footballs however they please to tilt a level playing field to make sure they can squeak out a victory.
There is nothing wrong with your post.  Your arguments are valid. Patriots fans can just go suck it and they can now know what it feels like to have an early off season just like the rest of the NFL teams normally get.  I am hopeful that this is just the start of the downward spiral for that loathsome franchise.  I hope that Bill Belichick spends the next 5 years going 3-13 or worse as the rest of the NFL starts to rip apart his horrible playbook and manners and dish back to him what he's been screwing the rest of the NFL over with for the past 20 years.  Belichick will die old, alone, and with no one at his funeral.  We'll all be sitting around saying, "Sorry Coach, we've moved on to Cincinnati."
SB 53 13-3
SB 51 34-28
SB 49 28-24

It's literally only their first 3 titles, the first of which no one even gave them a chance to win, that they won by 3 points each. But sure, it's not like they've blown out the Colts, Broncos, Steelers, Chargers and Titans, among others in the playoffs over the years. It's almost as if Super Bowls and Conference championships are supposed to be hard to win??? And winning by small margins doesn't detract from the fact that they won???

Hate on the Pats all you want. ****** and moan about whatever you want about them, but for crying out loud, get your facts straight.

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Facts aren't BS but think whatever you want.

This is total BS.  How many other divisions over the past 20 years have seen one team win the division 18 years out of 20?  (NY Jets in 2002, Dolphins in 2008).  Since 2001, the Dolphins and Bills have made the playoffs as a Wildcard twice, with the Jets getting a Wild card 5 times.
Here are the playoff records of the three other AFC East teams since 2001
  • Miami Dolphins 0-3
  • Buffalo Bills 0-2 (including this year)
  • New York Jets 6-6
It was quite a few years ago, but Peter King from SI posted the winning percentages of all four AFC East teams since 2001, and the rest of the AFC East teams didn't even come close to winning as many games as the Patriots did COMBINED.  Basically it's not even debatable that the AFC East is the least competitive division in all of the NFL for the last 20 years.
Basically I will simply say that I look forward to the demise of the Patriots, and them returning to their 1970's status of doormat of the league.  That's where they belong at this point.


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1 minute ago, FrogginBullfish said:

Facts aren't BS but think whatever you want.

 


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you replied too quickly to even read my post.  I stand by what I've witnessed for 20 freaking years.


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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, FrogginBullfish said:

I'm not saying it would have been overturned had they reviewed it or that they should have thrown a flag. I just found it odd they didn't even review it as there was a clear push off from Rudolph to create separation. I don't think it would have been a ticky tack call at all, personally. I'm fine with it as a non-call, but I'd have also been fine with it as a flag for OPI as well
 

 

They reviewed it.  There was a pause at the end of the game and a delayed Minnesota celebration while the officials spoke to New York.  There wasn't enough video evidence to warrant an OPI call.

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I read your post before I posted it but nice try. You're dismissing actual statistics that contradict what you feel to be true.

That being said, I'm so beyond done with these conversations. No matter the amount of actual real facts Pats fans can put in front of people like you, none of you are even willing to consider anything other than your own blind hatred over a team being successful for such a long period of time.

you replied too quickly to even read my post.  I stand by what I've witnessed for 20 freaking years.


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5 minutes ago, Middler said:

But again, the Belicheck-Brady dynasty is over whether they like it or not, they lost and deserved to this year, so how much longer do you want to argue about it? 

Well, since they've been cheating....errrr....winning for 20+ years, I figure I can go at least 25-30 years more.  😎

And if you want to talk about childish, just watch ANY Belichick press conference over the past 20+ years. 

Don't worry, "I've moved on to Cincinnati."  🙄

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That's all I got to say 

 

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