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What/How Did You Practice Today?


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Went to the range this afternoon. 

Irons felt great. Working on that shoulder/hip separation, and getting to a more consistent position at the top of the back swing.

Driver felt like garbage. It felt so uncontrollable as if the shaft was a hose pipe. I even belted one from the range onto one of the near by fairways.

Ever yelled 'FORE' on the range before? 😅😅

Driver: :cobra-small: Speedzone 9.5 degree (love this club)
Fairway Wood - :callaway-small: Warbird (to be replaced ASAP)
Hybrid - :taylormade-small: SIM2 MAX 19 degree, (not a fan, but getting there)
Irons - :callaway-small: Warbird 4 iron to PW (to be replaced ASAP)
Wedges - :taylormade-small: MG2 50 degree, :mizuno-small: T22 54 degree, :taylormade-small: Hi-Toe 58 degree
Putter -  LAB Golf - MEZZ.1 MAX - 2023 MGS TEST
Ball - :bridgestone-small: E6 (stands for 3-putt apparently)

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11 minutes ago, Splatt said:

Went to the range this afternoon. 

Irons felt great. Working on that shoulder/hip separation, and getting to a more consistent position at the top of the back swing.

Driver felt like garbage. It felt so uncontrollable as if the shaft was a hose pipe. I even belted one from the range onto one of the near by fairways.

Ever yelled 'FORE' on the range before? 😅😅

I'd be lying if I said no? 😆 

The driver is definitely something I need to get better at connecting with.

WITB-Foremost 551's - 3w, 5w, 5-SW (circa 1998), Top Flite 460cc Driver, Adam's 7w, Warrior GW and 60⁰, Odyssey AI-One DB putter.

Just an old newbie golfer, trying to learn and improve 1 club at a time.

 

 

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Went to tempo town yesterday on the sim.

Just trying to not worry about yardage and understand my miss better with each club. 

Don't get me wrong I still gave it the occasionally "lets see if we can get it there" try just to break things up and keep having fun

DRIVER PING.png G425 MAX w/ Mitsubishi Tensei Orange RAW 55 S 12*

WOOD TAYLORMADE.png.8ad786f4fccdf7215d321a861dfa1c7f.png STEALTH 2 Plus 3w w/ Mitsubishi Kali Red 65 S 15*

HYBRID PING.png G425 2h w/ Mitsubishi Tensei Orange RAW 65 S 17*

HYBRID PING.png G410 4h w/ Mitsubishi Tensei Orange 65 S 22*

IRONS MIZUNO.png.2bd95ff6ee2eb76ff25e7f5057c68c47.png 919 Forged 4i-PW w/ Dynamic Gold 105 S300 

WEDGES PING.png Glide Forged Pro w/ ZZ115 W 50*/58*

PUTTER Cleveland.jpg FRONTLINE 8.0 w/ 35" Slant neck 3*

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9 hours ago, Jim Shaw said:

my takeaway from the 3 examples given above is that 2 mention Fred Couples and Ernie Els, probably good role models, a couple of more I like are George Knudson and Gene Littler.

sounds like the jury is still out in regards to "walk fast, swing fast" "walk slow, swing slow" but it brings out food for thought...

I don’t know if the jury is out. Freddie and Ernie both swing how they walk. I’ve seen both in person in the early 2000s and they aren’t rushing anything, despite their smoothness in the swing they are applying  a good amount of effort in their swing. The rhythm and the sequencing of their swings is why it looks effortless.

The thing is to be you on the course. What happens is getting too fast or too slow will throw the rhythm of the swing off. When I try to slow down I get out of whack and when I try to get faster I get out of whack because I’m out of position. Too fast and I don’t complete the backswing. Too slow and the club and I don’t get a proper turn. 

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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5 hours ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

Going to the range today and working on wedge play. Want to dial in what I need for gapping and lie angle with the tours wedges.

what is your goal, ie: 40yd-60yd gap or full swing gapping? Lie angle should be easier as you will see if your toe on your wedge is up or down. 

5 hours ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

Going to the range today and working on wedge play. Want to dial in what I need for gapping and lie angle with the tours wedges.

 

committed to performance excellence

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I was at the range yesterday for about 45 minutes with a "high quality ball striking" objective. The process was to concentrate on:

1/ Take away,

2/ Swing plane, (biggie as this is causal for my miss),

3/ Sense of relaxed wrist at apex,

4/ Hip turn

I sampled my way through the bag and then "played a few holes". For an imaginary par 4, starting with driver, I picked a target and hit. Then used a mid iron to a flag target. Next a wedge. For an imaginary par 5, same start with driver, then I hit a fairway wood to a target. I finish the hole with and 8 or 9 iron. All shots were to targets.

I had a few balls left and hit 56 and 60 degree wedges to flags.

Putter Scotty Cameron Kombi
Driver 10.5 deg Callaway Rogue ST MAX
3W 13 deg Callaway Rogue ST
5W 15 deg TaylorMade M4
H4 22 deg TaylorMade M2
Irons Callaway APEX Pro Forged 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, PW
Wedges Callaway Mack Daddy 50, 56, 60

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1 hour ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

I don’t know if the jury is out. Freddie and Ernie both swing how they walk. I’ve seen both in person in the early 2000s and they aren’t rushing anything, despite their smoothness in the swing they are applying  a good amount of effort in their swing. The rhythm and the sequencing of their swings is why it looks effortless.

The thing is to be you on the course. What happens is getting too fast or too slow will throw the rhythm of the swing off. When I try to slow down I get out of whack and when I try to get faster I get out of whack because I’m out of position. Too fast and I don’t complete the backswing. Too slow and the club and I don’t get a proper turn. 

ahh, so you are conscious of your pace on the course, so that is a positive.

committed to performance excellence

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Snow on the ground; I'll be indoors for the next week or two anyway so indoor practice.

Putting: Practiced setup and eye position using a mirror, then made strokes swinging the putter head between gates set 1/5" (total) wider than my putter head. Woring on using a slight forward press to trigger beginning the swing. 

Full swing: Practiced grip, setup and backswing, checking my position at the top, followed by impact motion drills using really short swings. 

Ping G400 Max 10.5* - Kuro Kage HBP Black Gen 2, 44.5" length

Ping G425 SFT 5W (19*) - Alta CB Slate SR flex 

Ping G430 5H (26*), 6H (30*) and 7H (34*)- Alta CB 70 regular flex

Ping G710 8i-W - Recoil 80 F3 shaft (1)

Cleveland CBX4 50* and 58*, Smart Sole 4C - Recoil 95 F3 shaft

Odyssey Original 2-Ball White Hot counterbalanced (lead tape in the head, Super Stroke grip with 50-gram weight)

Other: Vice Pro or Maxfli Tour; Shot Scope X5; True Linkswear; Callaway Org 7 bag; Clicgear 3.5+

Currently doing a Member Review on Argolf's Pendragon XL Broomstick putter. 

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Went to the range on Sunday prior to when the snow storm hit here and wasn't overly concerned as to where my swing is as for the most part ball started on line and went where ai wanted it to go. What does have me concerned is that it seems that with my irons, the balls all seem to dead end at a certain point. Driver and fairways go a better distance but outside of ball flight, which are consistant, my iron distance has really taken a nose dive. I am hoping it is just due to age,  the clothes I am wearing, cold temps, and driving range balls.

Driver: Ping G430 SFT 10.5

Fairway Woods: Ping SFT G425 3-5-7

Irons;    Ping 425 4-LW

Putter:  Ping Sigma2 Anser Platinum

             Odyssey Tour#1 White Hot 

Ball:      Titleist Tour Speed

Bag:      Titleist

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12 hours ago, chisag said:

 

... Clearly you have never bowled, shot a free throw, served a tennis ball or actually hit a pitch. A bowling ball is heavy and you take steps while attempting to swing the ball back and release it near the wooden lanes. We have all seen balls tossed in the air and heard them land 40 lanes away and rattling in the bunker. Without getting into the other much more demanding endeavors than putting I'll simply say this. Take a 12 yr old reasonably coordinated young man and ask him to do any of the above for the very first time. Putting will be infinitely the easiest to accomplish. 

... And I either didn't describe it correctly or you misunderstood. 🤔  Yes, I believe putting is easy. Insanely easy. But actually making putts is much more difficult because you have to marry speed, line and read as well as having a repeatable stroke. 



 

 

 

With that 12 year old what do you consider successfully "accomplishing" the various skills?   will he be able to move the putter in a way resembling a stroke...sure, that is easy.  Will it be repeatable? doubtful.  Will he aim the putter effectively?  doubtful  Will he start the ball where he intended?  doubtful.  Will he read the putt correctly? doubtful  The putt will be in the the "general" direction of the hole probably with poor speed control.  

Bowling balls come in a variety of weights and I don't have to take steps to bowl; I can stand at the line and roll the ball.    Could we take that 12 year old and have him roll a ball down a lane and knock down pins?  Could he toss the tennis ball in the air and hit it over the net?  Could he hit a slower speed pitch?   

Putting requires you to worry about speed, line, read, and repeatable stroke which you said makes it more difficult.  From my perspective putting is not just the stroke but combining the skills of aim, stroke, read, and touch to maximize the opportunity for the ball to go into the hole.    What do you consider/define as putting when you say it is easy.    Does easy mean functional or good?   

This probably is really getting into our mechanical versus feel differences.  

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15*  w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype        
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :titleist-small: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite
Putter:   Sacks Parente MC 3 Stripe

Backup Putters:  :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, :seemore-small: mFGP2, :cameron-small: Futura 5W, :taylormade-small:TM-180

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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31 minutes ago, cnosil said:

  What do you consider/define as putting when you say it is easy.    Does easy mean functional or good?   

 

... I am talking about just "doing it" without a success rate. So functional. I have played all those sports as a 12 yr old and going to a putt putt/mini golf course for the first time was infinitely easier than the first time attempting any of the others. Becoming really good at anything takes skill, practice and desire. 

... And what you miss in your mechanical approach to ... well ... seemingly everything 😉 is if the actual doing is easy, the task at hand can be easy as well if we don't get in our own way. Or in other words the physical act of putting can be accomplished by most anyone. But putting is more subject to mental interference than any of the other endeavors I mentioned because it has infinitely more variables. I think we have all seen players stroke a straight, level 2 foot putt with ease dead center for a bogie and maybe even a par, but faced with a very rare birdie they miss all too often. Obviously this has nothing to do with speed, line, read, or even repeatable stroke from such a short distance but the self induced intense mental pressure of desperately wanting to make a birdie. You can usually see their hands shaking. 

... When I was teaching and you signed up for a 5 season package I gave a FREE short game lesson and I had many students I worked with on their putting. So I have experience on how well someone can accomplish the task of putting a golf ball and doing it reasonably well. The problem in paradise is putting really well is just much more precise than any of the other sports I mentioned that have a much larger margin of error. You can hit a baseball/softball on the ground, in the air to left/center/right field and be successful. Same with a serve in tennis and you can have a strike on either side of the head pin.

... I am sure we are on the same page with how difficult putting really well can be as we have both said there are quite a few variables that all have to be accomplished for a putt to go in the hole. But again, the physical act of moving a putter and hitting a golf ball toward the hole can be accomplished by a 2 yr old. Try having him/her bowl, serve a tennis ball or hit a low pitch. 

Driver:     :taylormade-small:    Qi10 10.5* ... Ventus Red Velocore 5R
Fairway:  :taylormade-small:    Qi10 5 wood ... Kai'li Blue 60R
Hybrids:  :ping-small:        430 Hybrid 22*... Diamana LTD 65r  
                  :taylormade-small:    DHy #4 ... Steelfiber 780Hy  
Irons:       :titleist-small:           '23 T200 5-Pw ... Steelfiber i95r
Wedges:  :titleist-small:           Vokey 50*/54*/58* ... Steelfiber i95r
Putter:     :cobra-small:    Sport-60 33" 
Ball:           Maxfli/:taylormade-small:  Maxfli Tour/TP5x

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33 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... I am talking about just "doing it" without a success rate. So functional. 
 

The problem in paradise is putting really well is just much more precise than any of the other sports I mentioned 

.. I am sure we are on the same page with how difficult putting really well can be as we have both said there are quite a few variables that all have to be accomplished for a putt to go in the hole. But again, the physical act of moving a putter and hitting a golf ball toward the hole can be accomplished by a 2 yr old. Try having him/her bowl, serve a tennis ball or hit a low pitch. 

I'll concede to this point.  It is easy to physically move a putter back and forth and hit a ball (functional but not necessarily correct stroke).  

And yes,  we are on the same page with how difficult it can be to improve skills to putt really well and that speed control is the most important/key aspect to putting well and where players should focus practice efforts.    I am probably focusing to much on improving someone with basic skills.....essentially someone like myself.   My response to the original post; that started our discussion, is related to making your stroke more precise which in my opinion starts with stroke skills since they have influence on the speed skills. Basically make the stroke more precise and not just functional. 

 

Edited by cnosil

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15*  w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype        
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :titleist-small: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite
Putter:   Sacks Parente MC 3 Stripe

Backup Putters:  :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, :seemore-small: mFGP2, :cameron-small: Futura 5W, :taylormade-small:TM-180

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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4 minutes ago, cnosil said:

I'll concede to this point.  It is easy to physically move a putter back and forth and hit a ball (functional but not necessarily correct stroke).  

And yes,  we are on the same page with how difficult it can be to improve skills to putt really well and that speed control is the most important/key aspect to putting well and where players should focus practice efforts.    I am probably focusing to much on improving someone with basic skills.....essentially someone like myself.   My response to the original post; that started our discussion, is related to making your stroke more precise which in my opinion starts with stroke skills since they have influence on the speed skills. Basically make the stroke more precise and not just functional. 

 

 

... As always I think we both agree that we agree much more than we disagree 😇  often dancing around the same conclusion from  different perspective. Unless I am wrong, where we differ on this subject is the physical ability to simply putt a golf ball. To make a repeatable stroke with the same path and face angle is something I contend is very easy. Much like many smooth looking golf swings when there is no ball there and then the mental side takes over addressing the ball and that smooth swing changes to something quite different because the brain is unindexed with line, speed, break and wanting to make the putt. The brain can only think of one thing at a time so it rapidly goes back and forth between all those thoughts without ever fully concentrating on any of them. It is why I suggest after looking at the your line and determining a break, concentrate on speed only as it I one thing and the chances of performing it correctly goes top exponentially with every other potential thought you ignore. As I have stated before I go into a blank state and think of absolutely nothing and just stroke my putt trusting my pre-read of all appropriate criteria is already in my sub conscious. 

... I believe if you take any golfer and have them stroke 10 putts on a practice green with no target, no line to hit or speed to accomplish they will make a repeatable stroke and start their putts on the same path and with a surprising consistent speed. So it isn't working on the physical act of putting a golf ball but the combination of that same stroke when there is speed, break, potential grain and most importantly the desire to actually make the ball go in the hole that changes that repeatable stroke turning it into something very different. 

...  I assume you can make a repeatable stroke without a ball there. Obviously with our radically different approach I would LOVE to have a putting session with you and attempt to strip away all thought, and just have you putt the ball. Certainly make putts with your eyes closed at the top o my list. I do think golf and especially putting leads itself to more paralysis by analysis than any other sport. I have witnessed thousands of golfers take a smooth practice putt, then do something different when they actually putt with a ball when it counts.

 

Driver:     :taylormade-small:    Qi10 10.5* ... Ventus Red Velocore 5R
Fairway:  :taylormade-small:    Qi10 5 wood ... Kai'li Blue 60R
Hybrids:  :ping-small:        430 Hybrid 22*... Diamana LTD 65r  
                  :taylormade-small:    DHy #4 ... Steelfiber 780Hy  
Irons:       :titleist-small:           '23 T200 5-Pw ... Steelfiber i95r
Wedges:  :titleist-small:           Vokey 50*/54*/58* ... Steelfiber i95r
Putter:     :cobra-small:    Sport-60 33" 
Ball:           Maxfli/:taylormade-small:  Maxfli Tour/TP5x

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Went to the gym and worked out using the Fit For Golf app

Driver: Titleist TSI3 9* @8.25, Tensei 1K Pro White 60 Tx

3 wood: Titleist TSI2 13.5* @14.25, Tensei 1K Black X

5 wood: Titleist TSI2 18*, Tensei 1K Black X

Irons: Mizuno Pro 223 (4-6), Mizuno Pro 221 (7-P) Dynamic Gold 120X

Wedges: Vokey SM8 50 08F, SM9 56 12D, SM8 60 04L

Putter: Scotty Cameron Newport Special Select

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I am experimenting with low and high hands at address and what that does for ball flight. The club sits differently in the hands depending on their position at address. It also determines the hip bend at address. So lots of things to think about.

Low hands would be like Keegan Bradley and high hands like DeChambeau. I am shortish so hand position is sometimes critical.

I like low hands with the driver because it makes it easier to come from the inside with a sweeping swing. It absolutely is chancy with fairway woods, at least for me. Top, fat, thin, shots that run the gamut. High hands are really easy. Further work with hybrids and irons to follow.

Is this too esoteric?

Driver: Callaway Epic 9 degree, stiff (set at 10 degrees with the movable weight in the center}

FW: Callaway Epic 3,5, heaven wood w/ regular shaft (driver shaft in 3 wood, 3 wood shaft in 5 wood, 5 wood shaft in heaven wood, all three set at neutral plus 1 degree)

Hybrids: Callaway BB19 4,6,7 (4 set at neutral plus 1 degree and 6 and 7 set at neutral minus 1 degree for gapping purposes)

Irons: Callaway Rogue ST Max 8, 9, PW 

Wedges: Titleist Vokey SM6 50,54,58

Ball: Titleist Pro V1, 1X, Vice Pro Plus or anything I find that day and try out for the fun of it (I haven't bought balls with my own money in at least 10 years)

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19 minutes ago, Beakbryce said:

I am experimenting with low and high hands at address and what that does for ball flight. The club sits differently in the hands depending on their position at address. It also determines the hip bend at address. So lots of things to think about.

Low hands would be like Keegan Bradley and high hands like DeChambeau. I am shortish so hand position is sometimes critical.

I like low hands with the driver because it makes it easier to come from the inside with a sweeping swing. It absolutely is chancy with fairway woods, at least for me. Top, fat, thin, shots that run the gamut. High hands are really easy. Further work with hybrids and irons to follow.

Is this too esoteric?

 

... Not too esoteric at all and experimentation (to a point) is essential for improvement. 👍 But the easiest and most effective way of insuring the most degree of repeatability is allowing your arms (hands are at the end of the arms of course) to hang naturally from your shoulders. Easy enough to compute regardless of how much or little hip bend you have. Just take your stance with your club leaning against your side for accessibility and allow your arms to hang down tension free, then simply put your grip in your hands at that position. Your arms will hang the same every time you address the ball, given a consistent stance. Above or below takes manipulation and is difficult to repeat. 

... That said plenty of high level players have their arms above or below their natural arm hang, but that takes hours and hours of practice and repetition. 

Driver:     :taylormade-small:    Qi10 10.5* ... Ventus Red Velocore 5R
Fairway:  :taylormade-small:    Qi10 5 wood ... Kai'li Blue 60R
Hybrids:  :ping-small:        430 Hybrid 22*... Diamana LTD 65r  
                  :taylormade-small:    DHy #4 ... Steelfiber 780Hy  
Irons:       :titleist-small:           '23 T200 5-Pw ... Steelfiber i95r
Wedges:  :titleist-small:           Vokey 50*/54*/58* ... Steelfiber i95r
Putter:     :cobra-small:    Sport-60 33" 
Ball:           Maxfli/:taylormade-small:  Maxfli Tour/TP5x

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54 minutes ago, chisag said:

Unless I am wrong, where we differ on this subject is the physical ability to simply putt a golf ball. To make a repeatable stroke with the same path and face angle is something I contend is very easy. Much like many smooth looking golf swings when there is no ball there and then the mental side takes over addressing the ball and that smooth swing changes to something quite different because the brain is unindexed with line, speed, break and wanting to make the putt. The brain can only think of one thing at a time so it rapidly goes back and forth between all those thoughts without ever fully concentrating on any of them. It is why I suggest after looking at the your line and determining a break, concentrate on speed only as it I one thing and the chances of performing it correctly goes top exponentially with every other potential thought you ignore. As I have stated before I go into a blank state and think of absolutely nothing and just stroke my putt trusting my pre-read of all appropriate criteria is already in my sub conscious. 

... I believe if you take any golfer and have them stroke 10 putts on a practice green with no target, no line to hit or speed to accomplish they will make a repeatable stroke and start their putts on the same path and with a surprising consistent speed. So it isn't working on the physical act of putting a golf ball but the combination of that same stroke when there is speed, break, potential grain and most importantly the desire to actually make the ball go in the hole that changes that repeatable stroke turning it into something very different. 

...  I assume you can make a repeatable stroke without a ball there. Obviously with our radically different approach I would LOVE to have a putting session with you and attempt to strip away all thought, and just have you putt the ball. Certainly make putts with your eyes closed at the top o my list. I do think golf and especially putting leads itself to more paralysis by analysis than any other sport. I have witnessed thousands of golfers take a smooth practice putt, then do something different when they actually putt with a ball when it counts.

 

I also agree that we agree more than we disagree.  The difference we have is how consistently a player can deliver the putter with the same face angle as that is what determines the balls direction.  Studies on consistently show that the average player has a face variability of +/- 0.9* and pros are about +/- 0.5*.   I haven't seen comparisons when there isn't a target.   When I have had mine measured, I am generally within .75* but do have the occasional bad face angle which is why I practice technique.   I tend to miss short putts right and longer putts left I am validating that I am stroking putts where aimed.  This comes from holding off short putts and getting a bit more of a hit action on longer putts.   

It may surprise you that I have little thought when I stand over the putt and I try to focus on speed. I have also putted with my eyes closed.   That said I am still aware of how my body is moving during the stroke; that is all feel.  

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15*  w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype        
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :titleist-small: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite
Putter:   Sacks Parente MC 3 Stripe

Backup Putters:  :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, :seemore-small: mFGP2, :cameron-small: Futura 5W, :taylormade-small:TM-180

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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Working on trying to get more shaft lean at impact.  Also working on not releasing the club too early.

its been hard for me to execute this…  This could take a while to fix.

Edited by KC Golf

:titelist-small:  TSR 3   9.0  GD Tour AD - DI 6S Stiff

:titelist-small:  TSi 3  15.0 GD Tour AD - DI 6S Stiff

:titelist-small: TS3  21 Hybrid Tensei AV Blue 65 HY Stiff

:titelist-small: U-510 19 Utility Iron HZDUS Smoke Black 6.0 Stiff

:Takomo:  5-PW 101T Irons - KBS Tour Lite Stiff - Official Tester 2023

:vokey-small: Vokey SM9 52 F - 12 Nippon NS Pro 950 Stiff

:vokey-small: Vokey Forged 56 M - 10  DG S200

:taylormade-small: MG3 60 - 12 NS Modus3 Tour 105 Stiff

image.gif.2bc8a27613a423a3721fd3b955802132.gif  Scotty Special Select - Squareback 2 - 35”  / Super Stroke Slim 3.0

 :srixon-small: Z-Star Diamond

 :titelist-small: Players 4 bag  image.png.939559f85230fe16347ecf2765438915.png    :redrooster:

 :Arccos: Official Tester - 2021 & Loyal MCC Plus 4 Sensor User

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10 hours ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

Going to the range today and working on wedge play. Want to dial in what I need for gapping and lie angle with the tours wedges.

I have almost resigned myself to either dumping or getting a lesson for my 59° Edison 2.0 Enforcer… Making strides with practice and technique changes with the 49° and 55°… The 59° is just purely obstinate in that neither practice or technique changes have done anything to enhance performance and/or consistency. About the only shot that it attempts and succeeds with any regularity at are short-sided bunker shots. 

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12 minutes ago, cnosil said:

I also agree that we agree more than we disagree.  The difference we have is how consistently a player can deliver the putter with the same face angle as that is what determines the balls direction.  Studies on consistently show that the average player has a face variability of +/- 0.9* and pros are about +/- 0.5*.   I haven't seen comparisons when there isn't a target.   When I have had mine measured, I am generally within .75* but do have the occasional bad face angle which is why I practice technique.   I tend to miss short putts right and longer putts left I am validating that I am stroking putts where aimed.  This comes from holding off short putts and getting a bit more of a hit action on longer putts.   

It may surprise you that I have little thought when I stand over the putt and I try to focus on speed. I have also putted with my eyes closed.   That said I am still aware of how my body is moving during the stroke; that is all feel.  

 

... Yup, I think it may boil down to I think a changing face angle is more due to a mental reason than a physical movement and you seem to think the opposite thinking it is more due to an actual physical difference, if I understand you correctly. My guess is someone making a putting stroke for an imaginary 6 foot putt without a ball and their eyes closed may produce some amazing face angle consistency. It is one of the few areas where natural ability obviously helps quite a bit, but practice, practice and more practice can make that face angle much more consistent, more so than a full swing when so much more is going on and athletic ability enters into the equation more than putting. 

... We have all seen and heard folks take a second putt and make it. "pulled/pushed the first one"... "didn't have enough/too much speed with my first". Many will even say it's because they recognized the error of their face angle, stroke or read and there is some truth to that but much more often than not, it is simply because it doesn't count and they are mentally freed up to make a free flowing stroke because they quite honestly don't care if they miss. 

Driver:     :taylormade-small:    Qi10 10.5* ... Ventus Red Velocore 5R
Fairway:  :taylormade-small:    Qi10 5 wood ... Kai'li Blue 60R
Hybrids:  :ping-small:        430 Hybrid 22*... Diamana LTD 65r  
                  :taylormade-small:    DHy #4 ... Steelfiber 780Hy  
Irons:       :titleist-small:           '23 T200 5-Pw ... Steelfiber i95r
Wedges:  :titleist-small:           Vokey 50*/54*/58* ... Steelfiber i95r
Putter:     :cobra-small:    Sport-60 33" 
Ball:           Maxfli/:taylormade-small:  Maxfli Tour/TP5x

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Worked on consistent putting address with a mirror. Then hit putts with varying takeback lengths (6", 8", 10" & 12") to work on tempo/distance control.

puttingmirrorsetup.jpg.77b57244ee2277ff4693ef0f15a70d5c.jpg

Edited by jbern
Added photo

WITB (link to detailed post here):

Driver:  Cobragolflogo.png.602fb363b272aeca0ae57ab591da02de.png LTDx 9* (ProjectX BlueSmoke Stiff)

Fairway metals:  TITLEIST_logo_15px.png.86858562876473681822bdce0336ecd4.png 3W TSR2 14.25* (ProjectX BlueSmoke Stiff) | PXG_Logo.png.e8b8454bf242754d2326ecb0a719cd30.png 5W Gen4 0341XF (Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 75 S)

Hybrid: PXG_Logo.png.e8b8454bf242754d2326ecb0a719cd30.png4H Gen4 0317XF (Mitsubishi Tensei Blue 75HY S)

Irons:   Sub70.png.5f7ea5565c2690f7d237f327e2e5238a.png 659 CB 5-AW (Project X Rifle 6.0)

Wedges:   Sub70.png.5f7ea5565c2690f7d237f327e2e5238a.png 286 54* & 58* (KBS Tour 120 S)

Putter:  Sub70.png.5f7ea5565c2690f7d237f327e2e5238a.png AL-6 armlock | Unofficial review here

Ball:   Vice_logo.png.282566e7be35424dbb3a5d3359e6385f.png pro drip: red & blue | MAXFLI_logo_15px.png.137df4bf59bf3628d99abc6ca08fd43f.png Tour S

Pushcart:  clicgear_logo.png.5569d627daa35e79384784c8a4e886f4.png 4.0 | '23 MGS Clicgear 4.0 Pushcart Tester | Link here

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1 hour ago, Beakbryce said:

I am experimenting with low and high hands at address and what that does for ball flight. The club sits differently in the hands depending on their position at address. It also determines the hip bend at address. So lots of things to think about.

Low hands would be like Keegan Bradley and high hands like DeChambeau. I am shortish so hand position is sometimes critical.

I like low hands with the driver because it makes it easier to come from the inside with a sweeping swing. It absolutely is chancy with fairway woods, at least for me. Top, fat, thin, shots that run the gamut. High hands are really easy. Further work with hybrids and irons to follow.

Is this too esoteric?

Lots of dangers in both options. Hand high like Bryson require a similar swing to Bryson and even moe Norman 

low hands pull you down and will cause too inside of a swing which will lead to lots of pushes, blocks push fades or the over correction and the pulls 

your hands should hand naturally with them below the chin for most irons. Then for driver let them hand then push them out a little.

Keegan has had his swing for years. He’s spent thousands of hours hitting balls and making the necessary compensations to hit the ball solid. Choosing an outlier on either end is not the smartest way to go about finding one’s swing

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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In 2023 I went from a 22 handicap to a 15 handicap, shot a 39 on a par 36 front nine, and was steadily inclining.

Being in New England means that if you aren't going down south to golf in the winter, you are either not swinging or you're hitting on artificial turf mats. 

I shut down for a month as 2023 was the most golf I've played in my life (I also just became a homeowner so I was a little consumed). Last year I started hitting a draw on my ball and increased my consistency ten fold while getting my shanks to almost zero. When I came back after the month I started hitting a fade and started shanking the ball again. 

 

My focus today and for a couple weeks now, is being softer at the top of my swing to allow that club to come from the inside again so I can get my ideal push-draw back again. I know I can get back to it but it's going to take work just like it did to drop my handicap by seven in one year. 

Taylormade R9 9 degree

Taylormade R9 3 Wood

Taylormade R9 5 Wood

Nike blades 4-P

Titleist Vokey Sm6 50 

Taylormade Milled Grind 56, 60

Ping Ally/ Oddessey Armlock

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About every other Wednesday (between two of my three golf days) my wife volunteers at our local SPCA which is just down the road from my home course.  On those days I'll usually chip and putt to help improve those skills.  Today however, we had a visitor:  Srixon!  Living at the southern end of US1, we tend not to have too many golf reps come down to visit Key West.  I guess because our course is a relatively high-volume Srixon, Cleveland and XXIO dealer, they felt someone should show up once ever four or five years and make an appearance.  

Srixon was not on my radar screen.   However, since I was there, I decided to give them a shot.  I walked up to the rep, introduced myself and showed him what I was playing (Callaway Paradym X irons).  He introduced himself, nodded as I explained my game and went to work putting together my first iron head/shaft combination.  I hadn't swung a club yet and this 67 year old body doesn't like to be immediately stressed!  After a few stretches and practice shots, I gave it a serious swing into our "driving range" which consists of 7 or 8 bays hitting into a two story netted area approximately 60-80 yards long.   After a few shots, the rep stepped over, changed the head and gave it back.  Immediately, I started hitting the ball better.  Straight and high (which I had trouble doing with the Paradym X's).  I mentioned that I used to be 2 degrees up in my irons.  He grabbed the iron, made the adjustment to get 2 degrees up and I immediately started to hook the ball.  His response:  "I guess your standard lie now!"  I looked at the model and it was the Srixon ZX4 Mk II with a 65 gram senior shaft.  I'm not sure which one as I was excited to the results.  I think it was the UST Recoil Dart 65 (the good news the rep wrote it down and gave it to my pro).

After my chipping and putting practice, I went to into the pro shop where the head pro asked "are you ready to be a Srixon golfer?"  I said we'll see.  Who knows?  

So today's practice:  I got some chipping and putting in and maybe found some new irons!

Ping G430 Max driver 10.5 degrees with an Alta Quick45 gram senior shaft
Callaway Epic 3 wood, Project X Evenflow Green 45 gram senior shaft  
Callaway GBB Epic Heavenwood, with a Mitsubishi Diamana 50 gram senior shaft
Ping G 20.5 degree 7 wood, with a stock Alta 65 gram senior shaft
Ping G 26 degree hybrid, stock Alta 65 gram senior shaft
Callaway Paradym X irons, 7-AW with Aldila Ascent Blue 50 graphite shafts
Edison wedges:  50, 55 and 60 degree, KBS Tour Graphite A flex shafts
Putters:  L.A.B. Direct Force 2.1 putter, 34.5" long, 67 degrees lie
 
2022 MGS Tester:  Shot Scope Pro XL+ with H4  
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2 hours ago, chisag said:

Not too esoteric at all and experimentation (to a point) is essential for improvement. 👍 But the easiest and most effective way of insuring the most degree of repeatability is allowing your arms (hands are at the end of the arms of course) to hang naturally from your shoulders. Easy enough to compute regardless of how much or little hip bend you have. Just take your stance with your club leaning against your side for accessibility and allow your arms to hang down tension free, then simply put your grip in your hands at that position. Your arms will hang the same every time you address the ball, given a consistent stance. Above or below takes manipulation and is difficult to repeat. 

... That said plenty of high level players have their arms above or below their natural arm hang, but that takes hours and hours of practice and repetition. 

 

54 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Lots of dangers in both options. Hand high like Bryson require a similar swing to Bryson and even moe Norman 

low hands pull you down and will cause too inside of a swing which will lead to lots of pushes, blocks push fades or the over correction and the pulls 

your hands should hand naturally with them below the chin for most irons. Then for driver let them hand then push them out a little.

Keegan has had his swing for years. He’s spent thousands of hours hitting balls and making the necessary compensations to hit the ball solid. Choosing an outlier on either end is not the smartest way to go about finding one’s swing

I am not actually looking for a swing. My low round in the last 3 months was a 67. Mainly because I actually made some putts which is another story. Ball striking isn't a problem. I'm bored, so trying stuff. Which is what I thought this topic was discussing. What am I working on and at the moment for me, I'm working on trying to keep it fresh with experimentation.

I didn't talk a lot about how I went about the experimentation, but depending on hip bend, low or high hands are possible with a natural arm hang. Which results in the hands somewhere close to below the chin. I only used Keegan and DeChambeau as examples to give a visual of what I am doing. It was mentioned that high hands require a swing like Dechambeau and or Moe Norman. I can swing like Dechambeau. In fact, swung that way since before he was born. Why is another story that I would be happy to share if you want.

I changed a little because of weight gain and needing to bend over to get the club far enough from the body to swing which resulted in lower hands. Have lost enough to go back to more upright and high hands, although the driver still feels better with low hands. 

I have been playing golf for more than 40 years and teaching for more than 30. Trust me when I say I can take any club in the bag and alternate between low and high hands and hit the ball pretty well. Sure, I wouldn't encourage a newbie to swing at the extremes that Keegan/Glover and DeChambeau/Norman represent. But a competent golfer ought to be able to start in either swing position, feel the club head, and have a good swing. Not that they would want to because it wouldn't fit them. But they ought to be able. What doesn't work for me is the middle of those 2 positions as I get a weak slice. Probably leads to a swing path that just doesn't work for me. What I am trying to do is find which one of those positions works best for me for each club. As I indicated one works best for the driver and one works best with the fairway woods. Hybrids and irons are next.

So I think we can agree on the whole arm hang thing. The only thing I may not agree with is that low hands automatically result in the club going back to far to the inside. Not been my experience. But even if it was, it's easy to correct.

I am not trying to convert anyone else or advocate that anyone else try it. I have the requisite thousands of hours of golf swings to do either. Just having fun with it.

 

 

 

Driver: Callaway Epic 9 degree, stiff (set at 10 degrees with the movable weight in the center}

FW: Callaway Epic 3,5, heaven wood w/ regular shaft (driver shaft in 3 wood, 3 wood shaft in 5 wood, 5 wood shaft in heaven wood, all three set at neutral plus 1 degree)

Hybrids: Callaway BB19 4,6,7 (4 set at neutral plus 1 degree and 6 and 7 set at neutral minus 1 degree for gapping purposes)

Irons: Callaway Rogue ST Max 8, 9, PW 

Wedges: Titleist Vokey SM6 50,54,58

Ball: Titleist Pro V1, 1X, Vice Pro Plus or anything I find that day and try out for the fun of it (I haven't bought balls with my own money in at least 10 years)

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Spot checking wedge matrix, club path drills, impact position drills, a quick 9 holes on Awesome Golf.

Even in the garage, the driver was near perfect on the range but AFK on the course.

Turrible.

Some putts with focus on getting the ball running straight end over end. Few hallway chips.

Ice and stretch.

Cheers
B

Odyssey XG #9

Cleveland CG15 wedges 54/58

Takomo 101 irons PW-4

Rescue hybrid 3 

M6 3W & Driver

Bridgestone e12 

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I practiced some endurance training…dog got out and decided it was a good time to go for a run, so I chased her for a solid 30 minutes before finally catching up to her…good times but no we’re both worn out!

Also decided to roll some putts with the Ai-ONE 7S…love this putter!

TaylorMade SIM 2 Max Driver

TaylorMade Stealth 3 wood

Titleist U510 Hybrid (3H)

TaylorMade Tour Preferred CB Irons

Vokey SM8 Wedges (52/56/60)

Odyssey Ai-ONE 7S Putter

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